That's okay. I I think it's like the engineering versus user ,

whereas like the engineering she showed that the engineering ones are more complex


whereas like the engineering she showed that the engineering ones are more complex

and users don't really need all of the buttons that are contained on there , because they only use ten percent of the buttons really.


and users don't really need all of the buttons that are contained on there , because they only use ten percent of the buttons really.


Mm-hmm.  And so people say that they typically lose it , as you yourself know , because you probably lose your remote control all the time ,


Mm-hmm.  And so people say that they typically lose it , as you yourself know , because you probably lose your remote control all the time ,

much like any small appliance like a cellphone ,


much like any small appliance like a cellphone ,

and they  we need something simple , because most people , well thirty four percent say that it's just too much time to learn how to use a new one , and we don't want to go  we don't want to vary too far from the normal standard remote ,


much like any small appliance like a cellphone ,

and they  we need something simple , because most people , well thirty four percent say that it's just too much time to learn how to use a new one , and we don't want to go  we don't want to vary too far from the normal standard remote ,

but I mean they do need to be able to identify it , and R_S_I_ , I'm not very sure what that is.


and they  we need something simple , because most people , well thirty four percent say that it's just too much time to learn how to use a new one , and we don't want to go  we don't want to vary too far from the normal standard remote ,

but I mean they do need to be able to identify it , and R_S_I_ , I'm not very sure what that is.


and they  we need something simple , because most people , well thirty four percent say that it's just too much time to learn how to use a new one , and we don't want to go  we don't want to vary too far from the normal standard remote ,

but I mean they do need to be able to identify it , and R_S_I_ , I'm not very sure what that is.

Yes , it is important for the remote control world.


but I mean they do need to be able to identify it , and R_S_I_ , I'm not very sure what that is.

Yes , it is important for the remote control world.

Wait , is that like your  ergonomics like your hand movements or something ?


Yes , it is important for the remote control world.

Wait , is that like your  ergonomics like your hand movements or something ?


Wait , is that like your  ergonomics like your hand movements or something ?


Do we really need t to provide more information on what R_S_I_ is ?


Do we really need t to provide more information on what R_S_I_ is ?

Uh yeah , that's what my web site said , I


Uh yeah , that's what my web site said , I


Uh yeah , that's what my web site said , I

I think that's a pretty good guess though.


I think that's a pretty good guess though.


I think we're supposed to know it as remote control experts.


I think we're supposed to know it as remote control experts.

But also s so the channel , the volume and the power buttons are the most important on our company website you can find like the specific statistics concerning to how much each button is used , but those are the definitely the top ones.


But also s so the channel , the volume and the power buttons are the most important on our company website you can find like the specific statistics concerning to how much each button is used , but those are the definitely the top ones.

Yes. And so personally I think that we need a modern eye-catching design , but it it really needs to be simple. So saying from y your slide , your presentation , the engineering versus the user-specified remotes , I think that we should go with something that's more user-friendly.


Yes. And so personally I think that we need a modern eye-catching design , but it it really needs to be simple. So saying from y your slide , your presentation , the engineering versus the user-specified remotes , I think that we should go with something that's more user-friendly.

Where the engineering ones , the boxes , tend to make it look more complicated than it really is. Um the functionality of the product really needs to be considered as to like what type of buttons do we really need on it. And it needs to be open to a wide range of consumers , so even though we need a small number of buttons , we also need to take in  like are most people going to be using it for a D_V_D_ player , a TiVo , what what exactly are we using it for , as well as the age range. So we need a hip , but not a corny marketing scheme for promoting our product.


Yes. And so personally I think that we need a modern eye-catching design , but it it really needs to be simple. So saying from y your slide , your presentation , the engineering versus the user-specified remotes , I think that we should go with something that's more user-friendly.

Where the engineering ones , the boxes , tend to make it look more complicated than it really is. Um the functionality of the product really needs to be considered as to like what type of buttons do we really need on it. And it needs to be open to a wide range of consumers , so even though we need a small number of buttons , we also need to take in  like are most people going to be using it for a D_V_D_ player , a TiVo , what what exactly are we using it for , as well as the age range. So we need a hip , but not a corny marketing scheme for promoting our product.

And also we found  our team found that speech recognition is  it's like an up-and-coming thing they really  consumers are really interested in it , and since our findings found that people are willing to pay more money for a remote for it to be more high-class we could consider it.


Where the engineering ones , the boxes , tend to make it look more complicated than it really is. Um the functionality of the product really needs to be considered as to like what type of buttons do we really need on it. And it needs to be open to a wide range of consumers , so even though we need a small number of buttons , we also need to take in  like are most people going to be using it for a D_V_D_ player , a TiVo , what what exactly are we using it for , as well as the age range. So we need a hip , but not a corny marketing scheme for promoting our product.

And also we found  our team found that speech recognition is  it's like an up-and-coming thing they really  consumers are really interested in it , and since our findings found that people are willing to pay more money for a remote for it to be more high-class we could consider it.

And so just to  just to clarify by speech recognition you mean they would say , channel five , and the thing would go to channel five ?


And also we found  our team found that speech recognition is  it's like an up-and-coming thing they really  consumers are really interested in it , and since our findings found that people are willing to pay more money for a remote for it to be more high-class we could consider it.

And so just to  just to clarify by speech recognition you mean they would say , channel five , and the thing would go to channel five ?


And so just to  just to clarify by speech recognition you mean they would say , channel five , and the thing would go to channel five ?

to just say , where are you , and thing beeps , you know.


to just say , where are you , and thing beeps , you know.


to just say , where are you , and thing beeps , you know.

Yeah , I guess we can interpret it like , we can just try out different types of speech recognition within our remote programme.


Yeah , I guess we can interpret it like , we can just try out different types of speech recognition within our remote programme.

Didn't they  um didn't our rival companies manufacture a remote that you would press the button on the T_V_ and it would  the remote would beep so if you have lost it


Yeah , I guess we can interpret it like , we can just try out different types of speech recognition within our remote programme.

Didn't they  um didn't our rival companies manufacture a remote that you would press the button on the T_V_ and it would  the remote would beep so if you have lost it

It's kinda like what the remote phone used to do.


Didn't they  um didn't our rival companies manufacture a remote that you would press the button on the T_V_ and it would  the remote would beep so if you have lost it

It's kinda like what the remote phone used to do.


It's kinda like what the remote phone used to do.

We could definitely include that if we wanted to.


We could definitely include that if we wanted to.


We could definitely include that if we wanted to.

If it's within our price. Okay. Are we ready for our last presentation , Amber ?


If it's within our price. Okay. Are we ready for our last presentation , Amber ?


If it's within our price. Okay. Are we ready for our last presentation , Amber ?

'Kay. I think it should be there , working design.


'Kay. I think it should be there , working design.


'Kay. Uh I didn't get a chance to complete this one , 'cause some of the tools that I was given were frustrating.


'Kay. Uh I didn't get a chance to complete this one , 'cause some of the tools that I was given were frustrating.

Uh okay , so method method of our design , I think I just start listing th some of the things that we actually need to put into this.


Uh okay , so method method of our design , I think I just start listing th some of the things that we actually need to put into this.


Uh okay , so method method of our design , I think I just start listing th some of the things that we actually need to put into this.

We need a power source , we're gonna need a smart chip if we're gonna make it multi-functional. Um extra functions will probably need an additional chip. Either that or the smart chip will have to be extremely smart.


We need a power source , we're gonna need a smart chip if we're gonna make it multi-functional. Um extra functions will probably need an additional chip. Either that or the smart chip will have to be extremely smart.

Usually a smart chip is just a chip that's been programmed and designed so that it can complete a fair range of functions.


We need a power source , we're gonna need a smart chip if we're gonna make it multi-functional. Um extra functions will probably need an additional chip. Either that or the smart chip will have to be extremely smart.

Usually a smart chip is just a chip that's been programmed and designed so that it can complete a fair range of functions.

Well , how much extra would the additional chip be ? Is that gonna push us over our production costs ?


Usually a smart chip is just a chip that's been programmed and designed so that it can complete a fair range of functions.

Well , how much extra would the additional chip be ? Is that gonna push us over our production costs ?

I wouldn't think so , 'cause we could probably get it from like , in bulk , from a a newer company. And they tend to sell their chips pretty cheap.


Well , how much extra would the additional chip be ? Is that gonna push us over our production costs ?

I wouldn't think so , 'cause we could probably get it from like , in bulk , from a a newer company. And they tend to sell their chips pretty cheap.


I wouldn't think so , 'cause we could probably get it from like , in bulk , from a a newer company. And they tend to sell their chips pretty cheap.


Um power source , I figured , batteries , 'cause they're easily available. Typically a remote has either two double A_s or four triple A_s , sometimes three. Uh it really kinda depends on the size of the actual remote itself.


Um power source , I figured , batteries , 'cause they're easily available. Typically a remote has either two double A_s or four triple A_s , sometimes three. Uh it really kinda depends on the size of the actual remote itself.

Um a large on-off button ,  demographically we're moving towards an older generation of people , so a large on-off button would probably be good.


Um power source , I figured , batteries , 'cause they're easily available. Typically a remote has either two double A_s or four triple A_s , sometimes three. Uh it really kinda depends on the size of the actual remote itself.

Um a large on-off button ,  demographically we're moving towards an older generation of people , so a large on-off button would probably be good.

Selection button for various entertainment devices , so you want something that will permit you to select the D_V_D_ player or the T_V_ or the stereo system. Um smart chip that perverts  uh that permits , sorry , universal application again , something that'll allow us to skip over between devices , and that's kinda it.


Um a large on-off button ,  demographically we're moving towards an older generation of people , so a large on-off button would probably be good.

Selection button for various entertainment devices , so you want something that will permit you to select the D_V_D_ player or the T_V_ or the stereo system. Um smart chip that perverts  uh that permits , sorry , universal application again , something that'll allow us to skip over between devices , and that's kinda it.


Selection button for various entertainment devices , so you want something that will permit you to select the D_V_D_ player or the T_V_ or the stereo system. Um smart chip that perverts  uh that permits , sorry , universal application again , something that'll allow us to skip over between devices , and that's kinda it.

Power source over here. We're gonna have a switch obviously between the power source and the rest of it , and you're gonna need the switch. Um extra bulb could just be for flashiness , um subcomponent which would be like a way of diverting the power to different parts of the the device. Um the chip and of course the infra-red bulb , so it can communicate with the various devices that it needs to talk to.


Selection button for various entertainment devices , so you want something that will permit you to select the D_V_D_ player or the T_V_ or the stereo system. Um smart chip that perverts  uh that permits , sorry , universal application again , something that'll allow us to skip over between devices , and that's kinda it.

Power source over here. We're gonna have a switch obviously between the power source and the rest of it , and you're gonna need the switch. Um extra bulb could just be for flashiness , um subcomponent which would be like a way of diverting the power to different parts of the the device. Um the chip and of course the infra-red bulb , so it can communicate with the various devices that it needs to talk to.

So what exactly we are looking at , is this like the front of the remote ?


Power source over here. We're gonna have a switch obviously between the power source and the rest of it , and you're gonna need the switch. Um extra bulb could just be for flashiness , um subcomponent which would be like a way of diverting the power to different parts of the the device. Um the chip and of course the infra-red bulb , so it can communicate with the various devices that it needs to talk to.

So what exactly we are looking at , is this like the front of the remote ?


So what exactly we are looking at , is this like the front of the remote ?


So the red would be the front of the remote though , right ?


Yeah , that's gonna be what's communicating with the T_V_ , but the other bulb , I think , is good to just to indicate , I'm doing something , it's sort of like a reassurance.


Yeah , that's gonna be what's communicating with the T_V_ , but the other bulb , I think , is good to just to indicate , I'm doing something , it's sort of like a reassurance.

Yeah , so you don't have to stare at that infra-red ,


Yeah , that's gonna be what's communicating with the T_V_ , but the other bulb , I think , is good to just to indicate , I'm doing something , it's sort of like a reassurance.

Yeah , so you don't have to stare at that infra-red ,

Like that we know the battery's working.


Yeah , so you don't have to stare at that infra-red ,

Like that we know the battery's working.


Yeah , so you don't have to stare at that infra-red ,

Like that we know the battery's working.

'cause you know when the battery starts dying in your remote currently , you have to actually stare at that bulb and go , okay , when I push this button , is it working ?


Like that we know the battery's working.

'cause you know when the battery starts dying in your remote currently , you have to actually stare at that bulb and go , okay , when I push this button , is it working ?

Hmm. It'd probably be lighting up the key too ,


'cause you know when the battery starts dying in your remote currently , you have to actually stare at that bulb and go , okay , when I push this button , is it working ?

Hmm. It'd probably be lighting up the key too ,


Hmm. It'd probably be lighting up the key too ,


Anything you wanna add for personal preferences though , you f you said already that we needed a large on-off button , you think. Anything else ?


Anything you wanna add for personal preferences though , you f you said already that we needed a large on-off button , you think. Anything else ?

I think that that's a good idea , because you know that's one of the most important buttons.


I think that that's a good idea , because you know that's one of the most important buttons.

Well , should it be larger buttons in general , you know like uh the examples that I had , they were swi quite small. So should we try and go for something that has l larger buttons ?


Well , should it be larger buttons in general , you know like uh the examples that I had , they were swi quite small. So should we try and go for something that has l larger buttons ?

I think we should. Like I think that would be in a as in  like in  for the design , sorry , um. I think we should definitely go with buttons that don't look like a normal remote , 'cause most remotes have small square buttons ,


Well , should it be larger buttons in general , you know like uh the examples that I had , they were swi quite small. So should we try and go for something that has l larger buttons ?

I think we should. Like I think that would be in a as in  like in  for the design , sorry , um. I think we should definitely go with buttons that don't look like a normal remote , 'cause most remotes have small square buttons ,

I think we should do something like maybe bigger and round like bubbles.


I think we should. Like I think that would be in a as in  like in  for the design , sorry , um. I think we should definitely go with buttons that don't look like a normal remote , 'cause most remotes have small square buttons ,

I think we should do something like maybe bigger and round like bubbles.


I think we should do something like maybe bigger and round like bubbles.

Okay. Okay , let's talk about all of our  We'll come to decision later about all the components that we need to include , let's um wrap up this one , and  I'm gonna go back to my PowerPoint , 'cause we need to discuss the new project requirements which you might've already seen flashed up on the screen a bit earlier.  Wait , come back. Alright. Sorry , let's go through this. Alright. Here we go. New product requirements. First it's only going to be a T_V_ remote. We're trying not to over-complicate things. So no D_V_D_ , no TiVo , no stereo.


Okay. Okay , let's talk about all of our  We'll come to decision later about all the components that we need to include , let's um wrap up this one , and  I'm gonna go back to my PowerPoint , 'cause we need to discuss the new project requirements which you might've already seen flashed up on the screen a bit earlier.  Wait , come back. Alright. Sorry , let's go through this. Alright. Here we go. New product requirements. First it's only going to be a T_V_ remote. We're trying not to over-complicate things. So no D_V_D_ , no TiVo , no stereo.


Okay. Okay , let's talk about all of our  We'll come to decision later about all the components that we need to include , let's um wrap up this one , and  I'm gonna go back to my PowerPoint , 'cause we need to discuss the new project requirements which you might've already seen flashed up on the screen a bit earlier.  Wait , come back. Alright. Sorry , let's go through this. Alright. Here we go. New product requirements. First it's only going to be a T_V_ remote. We're trying not to over-complicate things. So no D_V_D_ , no TiVo , no stereo.

Hey. And we th need to promote our company more , so we need to somehow include our colour and our company slogan on the remote. We're trying to get our name out there in the world. Okay.


Hey. And we th need to promote our company more , so we need to somehow include our colour and our company slogan on the remote. We're trying to get our name out there in the world. Okay.


Hey. And we th need to promote our company more , so we need to somehow include our colour and our company slogan on the remote. We're trying to get our name out there in the world. Okay.

in States we don't have it , but um it's like they just have this channel where just has news and weather , kind of sports ,


in States we don't have it , but um it's like they just have this channel where just has news and weather , kind of sports ,


in States we don't have it , but um it's like they just have this channel where just has news and weather , kind of sports ,

it's very um bland looking , it's just text on the screen ,


it's very um bland looking , it's just text on the screen ,


it's very um bland looking , it's just text on the screen ,

it's like black , black and white kind of


it's like black , black and white kind of


You can also get the kind of the T_V_ guide so


You can also get the kind of the T_V_ guide so

Wait , is it like the Weather Channel where it's got like the ticker running on the bottom or something ?


Wait , is it like the Weather Channel where it's got like the ticker running on the bottom or something ?


It's the entire screen is just running information at random.


It's the entire screen is just running information at random.

You can pick sports , you can pick the news , you entertainment ,


You can pick sports , you can pick the news , you entertainment ,


So it's like a separate channel from like what you're watching ?


So it's like a separate channel from like what you're watching ?

Right. But it's becoming out-dated now , because of the Internet.


So it's like a separate channel from like what you're watching ?

Right. But it's becoming out-dated now , because of the Internet.

Nobody needs to go to the teletext channel to check the news ,  and we have twenty four hour news channels now too , so  Those are our new product requirements. Alright. Mm-hmm.


Right. But it's becoming out-dated now , because of the Internet.

Nobody needs to go to the teletext channel to check the news ,  and we have twenty four hour news channels now too , so  Those are our new product requirements. Alright. Mm-hmm.


Nobody needs to go to the teletext channel to check the news ,  and we have twenty four hour news channels now too , so  Those are our new product requirements. Alright. Mm-hmm.


Nobody needs to go to the teletext channel to check the news ,  and we have twenty four hour news channels now too , so  Those are our new product requirements. Alright. Mm-hmm.

So , do we have to include the company colour within that ?


So , do we have to include the company colour within that ?


So , do we have to include the company colour within that ?

What we're going to do right now is come to some decisions , definitive that we can all agree on , about um the target group and the functions and just definite things that we need to do and then we'll close up the meeting. So. Alright.  Whatever. Okay. So our target group is  You mentioned um older people ? Would it just be universal for everyone , you think ?


What we're going to do right now is come to some decisions , definitive that we can all agree on , about um the target group and the functions and just definite things that we need to do and then we'll close up the meeting. So. Alright.  Whatever. Okay. So our target group is  You mentioned um older people ? Would it just be universal for everyone , you think ?


What we're going to do right now is come to some decisions , definitive that we can all agree on , about um the target group and the functions and just definite things that we need to do and then we'll close up the meeting. So. Alright.  Whatever. Okay. So our target group is  You mentioned um older people ? Would it just be universal for everyone , you think ?

Because I think even if something has large buttons , as long as they are not childishly large , like even technically


Because I think even if something has large buttons , as long as they are not childishly large , like even technically

non-technically challenged people are gonna use it. I mean they want something user-friendly , so


Because I think even if something has large buttons , as long as they are not childishly large , like even technically

non-technically challenged people are gonna use it. I mean they want something user-friendly , so

Mm well , even if we kept the regular standard size of remote , if we reduced the buttons down to the ones that people are saying that they use the most often and a couple extra ,


non-technically challenged people are gonna use it. I mean they want something user-friendly , so

Mm well , even if we kept the regular standard size of remote , if we reduced the buttons down to the ones that people are saying that they use the most often and a couple extra ,


non-technically challenged people are gonna use it. I mean they want something user-friendly , so

Mm well , even if we kept the regular standard size of remote , if we reduced the buttons down to the ones that people are saying that they use the most often and a couple extra ,

'cause they're saying they only use ten per cent of them ,


Mm well , even if we kept the regular standard size of remote , if we reduced the buttons down to the ones that people are saying that they use the most often and a couple extra ,

'cause they're saying they only use ten per cent of them ,


'cause they're saying they only use ten per cent of them ,

then we should be able to accommodate fairly decent sized buttons.


'cause they're saying they only use ten per cent of them ,

then we should be able to accommodate fairly decent sized buttons.

Okay , so we want um for our target group would we say , I mean , young and old , all age ranges , all um , not kids obviously , right ? Or kids ?


then we should be able to accommodate fairly decent sized buttons.

Okay , so we want um for our target group would we say , I mean , young and old , all age ranges , all um , not kids obviously , right ? Or kids ?

No , kids need to know how to use a remote , I would think.


then we should be able to accommodate fairly decent sized buttons.

Okay , so we want um for our target group would we say , I mean , young and old , all age ranges , all um , not kids obviously , right ? Or kids ?

No , kids need to know how to use a remote , I would think.

Most of them will intuitively pick it up though.


Okay , so we want um for our target group would we say , I mean , young and old , all age ranges , all um , not kids obviously , right ? Or kids ?

No , kids need to know how to use a remote , I would think.

Most of them will intuitively pick it up though.

They gotta change between Disney Channel , Cartoon Network.


No , kids need to know how to use a remote , I would think.

Most of them will intuitively pick it up though.

They gotta change between Disney Channel , Cartoon Network.

Okay , so we're going to go anywhere from kids to adult in the age range


Most of them will intuitively pick it up though.

They gotta change between Disney Channel , Cartoon Network.

Okay , so we're going to go anywhere from kids to adult in the age range


They gotta change between Disney Channel , Cartoon Network.

Okay , so we're going to go anywhere from kids to adult in the age range

Um what about technic technical um specifications , like how how technically literate are these people who are going to be using our remote ?


Okay , so we're going to go anywhere from kids to adult in the age range

Um what about technic technical um specifications , like how how technically literate are these people who are going to be using our remote ?

Um I would say we should say dumber than the average person.


Um what about technic technical um specifications , like how how technically literate are these people who are going to be using our remote ?

Um I would say we should say dumber than the average person.


Um what about technic technical um specifications , like how how technically literate are these people who are going to be using our remote ?

Um I would say we should say dumber than the average person.

We should go for the lowest denominator.


Um I would say we should say dumber than the average person.

We should go for the lowest denominator.


We should go for the lowest denominator.

Right , okay. So so they need no technical experience to operate


Right , okay. So so they need no technical experience to operate

how 'bout little to no , because there is no way that you are gonna be able to make it no.


Right , okay. So so they need no technical experience to operate

how 'bout little to no , because there is no way that you are gonna be able to make it no.

Okay. And we also need to determine the specific functions of this , just to get it all out on paper. So we said it needs to send messages to the T_V_ , needs to change the channel , turn on and off , just basic simple stuff like this. So if you have something just say it and we'll add it to my meeting minutes.


how 'bout little to no , because there is no way that you are gonna be able to make it no.

Okay. And we also need to determine the specific functions of this , just to get it all out on paper. So we said it needs to send messages to the T_V_ , needs to change the channel , turn on and off , just basic simple stuff like this. So if you have something just say it and we'll add it to my meeting minutes.

Well it's channel , on-off button , volume , mute.


Okay. And we also need to determine the specific functions of this , just to get it all out on paper. So we said it needs to send messages to the T_V_ , needs to change the channel , turn on and off , just basic simple stuff like this. So if you have something just say it and we'll add it to my meeting minutes.

Well it's channel , on-off button , volume , mute.

And channel. Yeah. Those are the most important ones.


Well it's channel , on-off button , volume , mute.

And channel. Yeah. Those are the most important ones.

Right. And we wanna keep um  I'll make a note here that we wanna keep the number of buttons down. Correct , because people only use ten percent.


And channel. Yeah. Those are the most important ones.

Right. And we wanna keep um  I'll make a note here that we wanna keep the number of buttons down. Correct , because people only use ten percent.


Right. And we wanna keep um  I'll make a note here that we wanna keep the number of buttons down. Correct , because people only use ten percent.


Do we want this thing to be able to be found easily ?


I need  we we need a like homing device.


I need  we we need a like homing device.

like if this is gonna get lost underneath the coach , how are we going to accommodate the quick ability to find it ?


like if this is gonna get lost underneath the coach , how are we going to accommodate the quick ability to find it ?


Because people really are looking for a remote that's more high-tech.


Because people really are looking for a remote that's more high-tech.

What if we gave it a charger ? And on the charger , just like a phone , like you get a portable phone and it's got a charger , and if you d leave your phone somewhere , you push the button to find it , and it finds th the phone beeps for you.


What if we gave it a charger ? And on the charger , just like a phone , like you get a portable phone and it's got a charger , and if you d leave your phone somewhere , you push the button to find it , and it finds th the phone beeps for you.

Do you think people'll really go for that though ?


Do you think people'll really go for that though ?


Would that add to our costs at all , I wonder ?


Would that add to our costs at all , I wonder ?

I would think so , because you'd have to develop a base.


Would that add to our costs at all , I wonder ?

I would think so , because you'd have to develop a base.

Well , if you have the base , you could start putting in a charger and then you have a different kind of battery.


I would think so , because you'd have to develop a base.

Well , if you have the base , you could start putting in a charger and then you have a different kind of battery.


Well , if you have the base , you could start putting in a charger and then you have a different kind of battery.


Well , if you have the base , you could start putting in a charger and then you have a different kind of battery.

Rechargeable batteries are cheaper usually.


Rechargeable batteries are cheaper usually.


Rechargeable batteries are cheaper usually.

Okay. I I think we can make a decision about that later. Uh we'll still put that as a point that we need to discuss. So that would include battery source  Power source rather. Is it going to have a charger , or is it going to be run strictly off batteries ? And we also need to deal with the issue you mentioned of speech recognition , if we want that.


Okay. I I think we can make a decision about that later. Uh we'll still put that as a point that we need to discuss. So that would include battery source  Power source rather. Is it going to have a charger , or is it going to be run strictly off batteries ? And we also need to deal with the issue you mentioned of speech recognition , if we want that.


If we have the speech recognition then we can start aiming at a like another kind of more handicapped disabled uh demo demographic.


If we have the speech recognition then we can start aiming at a like another kind of more handicapped disabled uh demo demographic.

Well , th there's the people who desire speech recognition , there's the different demog demographics have different desires , I don't know if you guys ge


Well , th there's the people who desire speech recognition , there's the different demog demographics have different desires , I don't know if you guys ge

It wouldn't copy onto the the thing 'cause it's black ,


It wouldn't copy onto the the thing 'cause it's black ,

but all the different age groups have different desires for speech recognition. So  basically older people don't really care.


It wouldn't copy onto the the thing 'cause it's black ,

but all the different age groups have different desires for speech recognition. So  basically older people don't really care.

It's really the people twenty five to thirty five. I feel those are the people that really watch a lot of T_V_ though.


but all the different age groups have different desires for speech recognition. So  basically older people don't really care.

It's really the people twenty five to thirty five. I feel those are the people that really watch a lot of T_V_ though.


but all the different age groups have different desires for speech recognition. So  basically older people don't really care.

It's really the people twenty five to thirty five. I feel those are the people that really watch a lot of T_V_ though.

They're the ones that get addicted to soap operas and


It's really the people twenty five to thirty five. I feel those are the people that really watch a lot of T_V_ though.

They're the ones that get addicted to soap operas and

And if and if we introduced it when they're this age , they're going to probably always buy a remote that has


They're the ones that get addicted to soap operas and

And if and if we introduced it when they're this age , they're going to probably always buy a remote that has


And if and if we introduced it when they're this age , they're going to probably always buy a remote that has

Well , then then do you put the voice recognition  do you put the r like receiver on the actual television , in the base , or in the actual remote ,


Well , then then do you put the voice recognition  do you put the r like receiver on the actual television , in the base , or in the actual remote ,


Well , then then do you put the voice recognition  do you put the r like receiver on the actual television , in the base , or in the actual remote ,

'cause then you've already got remote in your hand , why you just gonna speak to the remote ,


'cause then you've already got remote in your hand , why you just gonna speak to the remote ,

whereas if you just speak in general and you don't have to have the remote in your hand and like talk at it.


'cause then you've already got remote in your hand , why you just gonna speak to the remote ,

whereas if you just speak in general and you don't have to have the remote in your hand and like talk at it.

Yeah.  and the speech recognition could be part of the lost and found device , too. If we said , find remote , locate remote , or something.


whereas if you just speak in general and you don't have to have the remote in your hand and like talk at it.

Yeah.  and the speech recognition could be part of the lost and found device , too. If we said , find remote , locate remote , or something.


whereas if you just speak in general and you don't have to have the remote in your hand and like talk at it.

Yeah.  and the speech recognition could be part of the lost and found device , too. If we said , find remote , locate remote , or something.

A certain phrase then it could beep. I dunno. Just throwing it out there.


Yeah.  and the speech recognition could be part of the lost and found device , too. If we said , find remote , locate remote , or something.

A certain phrase then it could beep. I dunno. Just throwing it out there.


A certain phrase then it could beep. I dunno. Just throwing it out there.


Um. Well , do we wanna include the numbers like zero through nine ? Can we conceive of leaving them out ?


Um. Well , do we wanna include the numbers like zero through nine ? Can we conceive of leaving them out ?

Yeah , like you have one , two , three , four , five , six , seven , eight , nine , zero.


Yeah , like you have one , two , three , four , five , six , seven , eight , nine , zero.


Well , I don't know , I mean , if you can  like well


Well , I don't know , I mean , if you can  like well

I don't know , if there's just a way of leaving them out ?


Well , I don't know , I mean , if you can  like well

I don't know , if there's just a way of leaving them out ?

I think people would find that too foreign.


I don't know , if there's just a way of leaving them out ?

I think people would find that too foreign.


I think people would find that too foreign.

And also remember that in this day in age we need , you know , like a hundred button , too.


And also remember that in this day in age we need , you know , like a hundred button , too.


And also remember that in this day in age we need , you know , like a hundred button , too.

I used to have a remote that did not even go up past like fifty.  So I couldn't  whenever I got cable , I had to get a new T_V_.


I used to have a remote that did not even go up past like fifty.  So I couldn't  whenever I got cable , I had to get a new T_V_.

Mm.  get your own remote , or digital cable.


Mm.  get your own remote , or digital cable.

'Kay. Um. I guess , we're gonna discuss the project financing later , making sure that we can fit all of the stuff that we want to on our budget. Um.


Mm.  get your own remote , or digital cable.

'Kay. Um. I guess , we're gonna discuss the project financing later , making sure that we can fit all of the stuff that we want to on our budget. Um.

Yeah , 'cause I don't have any material pricing information available to me at the moment , so


'Kay. Um. I guess , we're gonna discuss the project financing later , making sure that we can fit all of the stuff that we want to on our budget. Um.

Yeah , 'cause I don't have any material pricing information available to me at the moment , so

'Kay. And don't forget we need to include the colour of our company and the logo.


Yeah , 'cause I don't have any material pricing information available to me at the moment , so

'Kay. And don't forget we need to include the colour of our company and the logo.


'Kay. And don't forget we need to include the colour of our company and the logo.


I feel like a ye I feel like a yellow one would be too garish.


Or put like stripes , oh yeah , yellow lights.


Or put like stripes , oh yeah , yellow lights.

Yeah ,  yellow could be and it could  doesn't have to be huge.


Yeah ,  yellow could be and it could  doesn't have to be huge.

Hang on. If you have this sort of strip kind of down at the bottom  the base of it , just like yellow with the R_R_.


Hang on. If you have this sort of strip kind of down at the bottom  the base of it , just like yellow with the R_R_.

Right. So we've simplified , we don't need all those um play , fast-forward , rewind ,


Right. So we've simplified , we don't need all those um play , fast-forward , rewind ,


So we've pretty much pared it down to on-off , volume , mute , channel up and down , um the numbers  Yeah.


So we've pretty much pared it down to on-off , volume , mute , channel up and down , um the numbers  Yeah.

Um can we go back to  I'm gonna look really quickly back at those


Um can we go back to  I'm gonna look really quickly back at those


Which one is yours , technical functions or functional requirement ?


Which one is yours , technical functions or functional requirement ?

Yeah , audi audio settings and screen settings , we need those like audio settings mono , stereo , pitch , screen settings like brightness , colour , or do we just want that accessed accessed from the television itself ?


Yeah , audi audio settings and screen settings , we need those like audio settings mono , stereo , pitch , screen settings like brightness , colour , or do we just want that accessed accessed from the television itself ?

The T_V_. I think that that's fine just for the T_V_. I mean how often does the average user need to do that kind of stuff ?


Yeah , audi audio settings and screen settings , we need those like audio settings mono , stereo , pitch , screen settings like brightness , colour , or do we just want that accessed accessed from the television itself ?

The T_V_. I think that that's fine just for the T_V_. I mean how often does the average user need to do that kind of stuff ?

Well , the other option is sort of like down at the bottom , like farther away , you just have this sort of box inset where it's like the buttons that you don't use as much , but occasionally you will use.


The T_V_. I think that that's fine just for the T_V_. I mean how often does the average user need to do that kind of stuff ?

Well , the other option is sort of like down at the bottom , like farther away , you just have this sort of box inset where it's like the buttons that you don't use as much , but occasionally you will use.


Well , the other option is sort of like down at the bottom , like farther away , you just have this sort of box inset where it's like the buttons that you don't use as much , but occasionally you will use.

Yeah , 'cause we need to  we definitely need to have buttons for like sub-titles and things like that. It's 'cause the foreign film market is expanding and stuff , and like on television like I know f k living in Los Angeles it's tons of Spanish network television if it has English sub-titles it's definitely helpful.


Yeah , 'cause we need to  we definitely need to have buttons for like sub-titles and things like that. It's 'cause the foreign film market is expanding and stuff , and like on television like I know f k living in Los Angeles it's tons of Spanish network television if it has English sub-titles it's definitely helpful.

Couldn't we do that all through one button , something , a menu button , that pops up with a menu on the T_V_ that says , you know , audio , video , whatever , language ,


Couldn't we do that all through one button , something , a menu button , that pops up with a menu on the T_V_ that says , you know , audio , video , whatever , language ,


So we need up , down , and side-to-side buttons.


So we need up , down , and side-to-side buttons.

Well , that could be  No you could just double up with like the channel or the volume buttons.


Well , that could be  No you could just double up with like the channel or the volume buttons.


Such as , yeah , the one the one over there on the left the engineering centred one.


So we just have it like  add a menu button then for the various things needed ,


So we just have it like  add a menu button then for the various things needed ,

including v voice recognition if we have any like settings for voice recognition now


including v voice recognition if we have any like settings for voice recognition now


good. Anybody have anything else they'd like to bring up in this meeting ?


I think for two years we were two months , uh , away from being done.

And what was that , Morgan ? What project ?


And what was that , Morgan ? What project ?


Uh , uh , we went through it  Jim and I went through old emails at one point and  and for two years there was this thing saying , yeah , we 're  we 're two months away from being done. It was very  very believable schedules , too. I mean , we went through and  with the schedules  and we


Uh , uh , we went through it  Jim and I went through old emails at one point and  and for two years there was this thing saying , yeah , we 're  we 're two months away from being done. It was very  very believable schedules , too. I mean , we went through and  with the schedules  and we

So , should we just do the same kind of deal where we  go around and do , uh , status report  kind of things ? OK. And I guess when Sunil gets here he can do his last or something. So.


So , should we just do the same kind of deal where we  go around and do , uh , status report  kind of things ? OK. And I guess when Sunil gets here he can do his last or something. So.

Yeah. So we  probably should wait for him to come before we do his.


Yeah. So we  probably should wait for him to come before we do his.


Do you want to start , Morgan ? Do you have anything , or  ?


Do you want to start , Morgan ? Do you have anything , or  ?

Uh , I don't do anything. I  No , I mean , I  I 'm involved in discussions with  with people about what they 're doing , but I think they 're  since they 're here , they can talk about it themselves.


Uh , I don't do anything. I  No , I mean , I  I 'm involved in discussions with  with people about what they 're doing , but I think they 're  since they 're here , they can talk about it themselves.

you 're gonna talk about Aurora stuff , per se ?


you 're gonna talk about Aurora stuff , per se ?


you 're gonna talk about Aurora stuff , per se ?

OK. Um. Well , this past week I 've just been , uh , getting down and dirty into writing my  my proposal. So , um  Mmm. I just finished a section on , uh  on talking about these intermediate categories that I want to classify , um , as a  as a middle step. And , um , I hope to  hope to get this , um  a full rough draft done by , uh , Monday so I can give it to Morgan.


OK. Um. Well , this past week I 've just been , uh , getting down and dirty into writing my  my proposal. So , um  Mmm. I just finished a section on , uh  on talking about these intermediate categories that I want to classify , um , as a  as a middle step. And , um , I hope to  hope to get this , um  a full rough draft done by , uh , Monday so I can give it to Morgan.


with , uh  ? Oh , oh , you mean the  the quals.


with , uh  ? Oh , oh , you mean the  the quals.

Uh , the quals are happening in July twenty - fifth.


Uh , the quals are happening in July twenty - fifth.


So , is the idea you 're going to do this paper and then you pass it out to everybody ahead of time and  ?


So , is the idea you 're going to do this paper and then you pass it out to everybody ahead of time and  ?

Right , right. So , y you write up a proposal , and give it to people ahead of time , and you have a short presentation. And , um , and then , um  then everybody asks you questions.


Right , right. So , y you write up a proposal , and give it to people ahead of time , and you have a short presentation. And , um , and then , um  then everybody asks you questions.


Have you d ? I was just gonna ask , do you want to say any  a little bit about it ,


Wh - what you 're  what you 're gonna  You said  you were talking about the , uh , particular features that you were looking at ,


Wh - what you 're  what you 're gonna  You said  you were talking about the , uh , particular features that you were looking at ,

Right. Well , I was , um , I think one of the perplexing problems is , um , for a while I was thinking that I had to come up with a complete set of intermediate features  in intermediate categories to  to classify right away. But what I 'm thinking now is , I would start with  with a reasonable set. Something  something like , um , um  like , uh , re regular phonetic features , just to  just to start off that way. And do some phone recognition. Um , build a system that , uh , classifies these , um  these feat uh , these intermediate categories using , uh , multi - band techniques. Combine them and do phon phoneme recognition. Look at  then I would look at the errors produced in the phoneme recognition and say , OK , well , I could probably reduce the errors if I included this extra feature or this extra intermediate category. That would  that would reduce certain confusions over other confusions. And then  and then  reiterate. Um , build the intermediate classifiers. Uh , do phoneme recognition. Look at the errors. And then postulate new  or remove , um , intermediate categories. And then do it again.


Right. Well , I was , um , I think one of the perplexing problems is , um , for a while I was thinking that I had to come up with a complete set of intermediate features  in intermediate categories to  to classify right away. But what I 'm thinking now is , I would start with  with a reasonable set. Something  something like , um , um  like , uh , re regular phonetic features , just to  just to start off that way. And do some phone recognition. Um , build a system that , uh , classifies these , um  these feat uh , these intermediate categories using , uh , multi - band techniques. Combine them and do phon phoneme recognition. Look at  then I would look at the errors produced in the phoneme recognition and say , OK , well , I could probably reduce the errors if I included this extra feature or this extra intermediate category. That would  that would reduce certain confusions over other confusions. And then  and then  reiterate. Um , build the intermediate classifiers. Uh , do phoneme recognition. Look at the errors. And then postulate new  or remove , um , intermediate categories. And then do it again.


Right. Well , I was , um , I think one of the perplexing problems is , um , for a while I was thinking that I had to come up with a complete set of intermediate features  in intermediate categories to  to classify right away. But what I 'm thinking now is , I would start with  with a reasonable set. Something  something like , um , um  like , uh , re regular phonetic features , just to  just to start off that way. And do some phone recognition. Um , build a system that , uh , classifies these , um  these feat uh , these intermediate categories using , uh , multi - band techniques. Combine them and do phon phoneme recognition. Look at  then I would look at the errors produced in the phoneme recognition and say , OK , well , I could probably reduce the errors if I included this extra feature or this extra intermediate category. That would  that would reduce certain confusions over other confusions. And then  and then  reiterate. Um , build the intermediate classifiers. Uh , do phoneme recognition. Look at the errors. And then postulate new  or remove , um , intermediate categories. And then do it again.

Um , for that  for that part of the  the process , yeah , I would use TIMIT.


Um , for that  for that part of the  the process , yeah , I would use TIMIT.

And , um , then  after  after , uh , um , doing TIMIT. Right ?


And , um , then  after  after , uh , um , doing TIMIT. Right ?

Um , that 's   that 's , um  that 's just the ph the phone recognition task.


Um , that 's   that 's , um  that 's just the ph the phone recognition task.

Uh , I wanted to take a look at , um , things that I could model within word. So , I would mov I would then shift the focus to , um , something like Schw - Switchboard , uh , where I 'd  I would be able to , um  to model , um , intermediate categories that span across phonemes ,


Uh , I wanted to take a look at , um , things that I could model within word. So , I would mov I would then shift the focus to , um , something like Schw - Switchboard , uh , where I 'd  I would be able to , um  to model , um , intermediate categories that span across phonemes ,

not just within the phonemes , themselves , um , and then do the same process there , um , on  on a large vocabulary task like Switchboard. Uh , and for that  for that part I would  I 'd use the SRI recognizer since it 's already set up for  for Switchboard. And I 'd run some  some sort of tandem - style processing with , uh , my intermediate classifiers.


Uh , I wanted to take a look at , um , things that I could model within word. So , I would mov I would then shift the focus to , um , something like Schw - Switchboard , uh , where I 'd  I would be able to , um  to model , um , intermediate categories that span across phonemes ,

not just within the phonemes , themselves , um , and then do the same process there , um , on  on a large vocabulary task like Switchboard. Uh , and for that  for that part I would  I 'd use the SRI recognizer since it 's already set up for  for Switchboard. And I 'd run some  some sort of tandem - style processing with , uh , my intermediate classifiers.

Oh. So that 's why you were interested in getting your own features into the SRI files.


not just within the phonemes , themselves , um , and then do the same process there , um , on  on a large vocabulary task like Switchboard. Uh , and for that  for that part I would  I 'd use the SRI recognizer since it 's already set up for  for Switchboard. And I 'd run some  some sort of tandem - style processing with , uh , my intermediate classifiers.

Oh. So that 's why you were interested in getting your own features into the SRI files.

Yeah. That 's why I  I was asking about that.


Oh. So that 's why you were interested in getting your own features into the SRI files.

Yeah. That 's why I  I was asking about that.

Yeah. Um , and I guess that 's  that 's it. Any  any questions ?


Yeah. That 's why I  I was asking about that.

Yeah. Um , and I guess that 's  that 's it. Any  any questions ?

Sounds good. So you just have a few more weeks , huh ?


Yeah. Um , and I guess that 's  that 's it. Any  any questions ?

Sounds good. So you just have a few more weeks , huh ?


Sounds good. So you just have a few more weeks , huh ?


So , uh , you want to go next , Dave ? And we 'll do


So , uh , you want to go next , Dave ? And we 'll do

Oh. OK , sure. So , um , last week I finally got results from the SRI system about this mean subtraction approach. And , um , we  we got an improvement , uh , in word error rate , training on the TI - digits data set and testing on Meeting Recorder digits of , um ,  six percent to four point five percent , um , on the n on the far - mike data using PZM F , but , um , the near - mike performance worsened , um , from one point two percent to two point four percent. And , um , wh why would that be , um ,  considering that we actually got an improvement in near - mike performance using HTK ? And so , uh , with some input from , uh , Andreas , I have a theory in two parts. Um , first of all HTK  sorry , SR - the SRI system is doing channel adaptation , and so HTK wasn't. Um , so this , um  This mean subtraction approach will do a kind of channel  normalization and so that might have given the HTK use of it a boost that wouldn't have been applied in the SRI case. And also , um , the  Andreas pointed out the SRI system is using more parameters. It 's got finer - grained acoustic models. So those finer - grained acoustic models could be more sensitive to the artifacts  in the re - synthesized audio. Um. And me and Barry were listening to the re - synthesized audio and sometimes it seems like you get of a bit of an echo of speech in the background. And so that seems like it could be difficult for training , cuz you could have  different phones  lined up with a different foreground phone ,  um ,  depending on  the timing of the echo. So , um , I 'm gonna try training on a larger data set , and then , eh , the system will have seen more examples o of these artifacts and hopefully will be more robust to them. So I 'm planning to use the Macrophone set of , um , read speech , and , um  Hmm.


So , uh , you want to go next , Dave ? And we 'll do

Oh. OK , sure. So , um , last week I finally got results from the SRI system about this mean subtraction approach. And , um , we  we got an improvement , uh , in word error rate , training on the TI - digits data set and testing on Meeting Recorder digits of , um ,  six percent to four point five percent , um , on the n on the far - mike data using PZM F , but , um , the near - mike performance worsened , um , from one point two percent to two point four percent. And , um , wh why would that be , um ,  considering that we actually got an improvement in near - mike performance using HTK ? And so , uh , with some input from , uh , Andreas , I have a theory in two parts. Um , first of all HTK  sorry , SR - the SRI system is doing channel adaptation , and so HTK wasn't. Um , so this , um  This mean subtraction approach will do a kind of channel  normalization and so that might have given the HTK use of it a boost that wouldn't have been applied in the SRI case. And also , um , the  Andreas pointed out the SRI system is using more parameters. It 's got finer - grained acoustic models. So those finer - grained acoustic models could be more sensitive to the artifacts  in the re - synthesized audio. Um. And me and Barry were listening to the re - synthesized audio and sometimes it seems like you get of a bit of an echo of speech in the background. And so that seems like it could be difficult for training , cuz you could have  different phones  lined up with a different foreground phone ,  um ,  depending on  the timing of the echo. So , um , I 'm gonna try training on a larger data set , and then , eh , the system will have seen more examples o of these artifacts and hopefully will be more robust to them. So I 'm planning to use the Macrophone set of , um , read speech , and , um  Hmm.

I had another thought just now , which is , uh , remember we were talking before about  we were talking in our meeting about , uh , this stuff that  some of the other stuff that Avendano did , where they were , um , getting rid of low - energy  sections ? Um , uh , if you  if you did a high - pass filtering , as Hirsch did in  late eighties to reduce some of the effects of reverberation , uh , uh , Avendano and Hermansky were arguing that , uh , perhaps one of the reasons for that working was ma may not have even been the filtering so much but the fact that when you filter a  an all - positive power spectrum you get some negative values , and you gotta figure out what to do with them if you 're gonna continue treating this as a power spectrum. So , what  what Hirsch did was , uh , set them to zero  set the negative values to zero. So if you imagine a  a waveform that 's all positive , which is the time trajectory of energy , um , and , uh , shifting it downwards , and then getting rid of the negative parts , that 's essentially throwing away the low - energy things. And it 's the low - energy parts of the speech where the reverberation is most audible. You know , you have the reverberation from higher - energy things showing up in  So in this case you have some artificially imposed  reverberation - like thing. I mean , you 're getting rid of some of the other effects of reverberation , but because you have these non - causal windows , you 're getting these funny things coming in , uh , at n And , um , what if you did  ? I mean , there 's nothing to say that the  the processing for this re - synthesis has to be restricted to trying to get it back to the original , according to some equation. I mean , you also could , uh , just try to make it nicer.


Oh. OK , sure. So , um , last week I finally got results from the SRI system about this mean subtraction approach. And , um , we  we got an improvement , uh , in word error rate , training on the TI - digits data set and testing on Meeting Recorder digits of , um ,  six percent to four point five percent , um , on the n on the far - mike data using PZM F , but , um , the near - mike performance worsened , um , from one point two percent to two point four percent. And , um , wh why would that be , um ,  considering that we actually got an improvement in near - mike performance using HTK ? And so , uh , with some input from , uh , Andreas , I have a theory in two parts. Um , first of all HTK  sorry , SR - the SRI system is doing channel adaptation , and so HTK wasn't. Um , so this , um  This mean subtraction approach will do a kind of channel  normalization and so that might have given the HTK use of it a boost that wouldn't have been applied in the SRI case. And also , um , the  Andreas pointed out the SRI system is using more parameters. It 's got finer - grained acoustic models. So those finer - grained acoustic models could be more sensitive to the artifacts  in the re - synthesized audio. Um. And me and Barry were listening to the re - synthesized audio and sometimes it seems like you get of a bit of an echo of speech in the background. And so that seems like it could be difficult for training , cuz you could have  different phones  lined up with a different foreground phone ,  um ,  depending on  the timing of the echo. So , um , I 'm gonna try training on a larger data set , and then , eh , the system will have seen more examples o of these artifacts and hopefully will be more robust to them. So I 'm planning to use the Macrophone set of , um , read speech , and , um  Hmm.

I had another thought just now , which is , uh , remember we were talking before about  we were talking in our meeting about , uh , this stuff that  some of the other stuff that Avendano did , where they were , um , getting rid of low - energy  sections ? Um , uh , if you  if you did a high - pass filtering , as Hirsch did in  late eighties to reduce some of the effects of reverberation , uh , uh , Avendano and Hermansky were arguing that , uh , perhaps one of the reasons for that working was ma may not have even been the filtering so much but the fact that when you filter a  an all - positive power spectrum you get some negative values , and you gotta figure out what to do with them if you 're gonna continue treating this as a power spectrum. So , what  what Hirsch did was , uh , set them to zero  set the negative values to zero. So if you imagine a  a waveform that 's all positive , which is the time trajectory of energy , um , and , uh , shifting it downwards , and then getting rid of the negative parts , that 's essentially throwing away the low - energy things. And it 's the low - energy parts of the speech where the reverberation is most audible. You know , you have the reverberation from higher - energy things showing up in  So in this case you have some artificially imposed  reverberation - like thing. I mean , you 're getting rid of some of the other effects of reverberation , but because you have these non - causal windows , you 're getting these funny things coming in , uh , at n And , um , what if you did  ? I mean , there 's nothing to say that the  the processing for this re - synthesis has to be restricted to trying to get it back to the original , according to some equation. I mean , you also could , uh , just try to make it nicer.

And one of the things you could do is , you could do some sort of VAD - like thing


I had another thought just now , which is , uh , remember we were talking before about  we were talking in our meeting about , uh , this stuff that  some of the other stuff that Avendano did , where they were , um , getting rid of low - energy  sections ? Um , uh , if you  if you did a high - pass filtering , as Hirsch did in  late eighties to reduce some of the effects of reverberation , uh , uh , Avendano and Hermansky were arguing that , uh , perhaps one of the reasons for that working was ma may not have even been the filtering so much but the fact that when you filter a  an all - positive power spectrum you get some negative values , and you gotta figure out what to do with them if you 're gonna continue treating this as a power spectrum. So , what  what Hirsch did was , uh , set them to zero  set the negative values to zero. So if you imagine a  a waveform that 's all positive , which is the time trajectory of energy , um , and , uh , shifting it downwards , and then getting rid of the negative parts , that 's essentially throwing away the low - energy things. And it 's the low - energy parts of the speech where the reverberation is most audible. You know , you have the reverberation from higher - energy things showing up in  So in this case you have some artificially imposed  reverberation - like thing. I mean , you 're getting rid of some of the other effects of reverberation , but because you have these non - causal windows , you 're getting these funny things coming in , uh , at n And , um , what if you did  ? I mean , there 's nothing to say that the  the processing for this re - synthesis has to be restricted to trying to get it back to the original , according to some equation. I mean , you also could , uh , just try to make it nicer.

And one of the things you could do is , you could do some sort of VAD - like thing


And one of the things you could do is , you could do some sort of VAD - like thing

and you actually could take very low - energy sections and set them to some  some , uh , very low or  or near zero  value. I mean , uh , I 'm just saying if in fact it turns out that  that these echoes that you 're hearing are , uh


and you actually could take very low - energy sections and set them to some  some , uh , very low or  or near zero  value. I mean , uh , I 'm just saying if in fact it turns out that  that these echoes that you 're hearing are , uh

or pre - echoes , whichever they are  are  are , uh , part of what 's causing the problem , you actually could get rid of them.


or pre - echoes , whichever they are  are  are , uh , part of what 's causing the problem , you actually could get rid of them.

Be pretty simple. I mean , you do it in a pretty conservative way


Be pretty simple. I mean , you do it in a pretty conservative way

so that if you made a mistake you were more likely to  keep in an echo than to throw out speech.


so that if you made a mistake you were more likely to  keep in an echo than to throw out speech.

Um , what is the reverberation time  like  there ?


Um , what is the reverberation time  like  there ?

On , uh , the  the one what  the s in the speech that you are  you are using like ?


On , uh , the  the one what  the s in the speech that you are  you are using like ?


so it 's  these are just microphone  this micro close microphone and a distant microphone , he 's doing these different tests on.


so it 's  these are just microphone  this micro close microphone and a distant microphone , he 's doing these different tests on.

Uh , we should do a measurement in here. I g think we never have. I think it 's  I would guess , uh , point seven , point eight seconds f uh , R T


Uh , we should do a measurement in here. I g think we never have. I think it 's  I would guess , uh , point seven , point eight seconds f uh , R T

something like that ? But it 's  you know , it 's this room.


something like that ? But it 's  you know , it 's this room.


Uh. But the other thing is , he 's putting in  w I was using the word " reverberation " in two ways. He 's also putting in , uh , a  he 's taking out some reverberation , but he 's putting in something , because he has  averages over multiple windows stretching out to twelve seconds , which are then being subtracted from the speech. And since , you know , what you subtract , sometimes you 'll be  you 'll be subtracting from some larger number and sometimes you won't. And


Uh. But the other thing is , he 's putting in  w I was using the word " reverberation " in two ways. He 's also putting in , uh , a  he 's taking out some reverberation , but he 's putting in something , because he has  averages over multiple windows stretching out to twelve seconds , which are then being subtracted from the speech. And since , you know , what you subtract , sometimes you 'll be  you 'll be subtracting from some larger number and sometimes you won't. And

So you can end up with some components in it that are affected by things that are seconds away. Uh , and if it 's a low  energy compo portion , you might actually hear some  funny things.


So you can end up with some components in it that are affected by things that are seconds away. Uh , and if it 's a low  energy compo portion , you might actually hear some  funny things.

O o one thing , um , I noticed is that , um , the mean subtraction seems to make the PZM signals louder after they 've been re - synthesized. So I was wondering , is it possible that one reason it helped with the Aurora baseline system is  just as a kind of gain control ? Cuz some of the PZM signals sound pretty quiet if you don't amplify them.


So you can end up with some components in it that are affected by things that are seconds away. Uh , and if it 's a low  energy compo portion , you might actually hear some  funny things.

O o one thing , um , I noticed is that , um , the mean subtraction seems to make the PZM signals louder after they 've been re - synthesized. So I was wondering , is it possible that one reason it helped with the Aurora baseline system is  just as a kind of gain control ? Cuz some of the PZM signals sound pretty quiet if you don't amplify them.

Mm - hmm. I don't see why  why your signal is louder after processing , because yo


O o one thing , um , I noticed is that , um , the mean subtraction seems to make the PZM signals louder after they 've been re - synthesized. So I was wondering , is it possible that one reason it helped with the Aurora baseline system is  just as a kind of gain control ? Cuz some of the PZM signals sound pretty quiet if you don't amplify them.

Mm - hmm. I don't see why  why your signal is louder after processing , because yo

Yeah. I don't know why - y , uh , either.


Mm - hmm. I don't see why  why your signal is louder after processing , because yo

Yeah. I don't know why - y , uh , either.

I don't think just multiplying the signal by two would have any effect.


Yeah. I don't know why - y , uh , either.

I don't think just multiplying the signal by two would have any effect.


I don't think just multiplying the signal by two would have any effect.


I don't think just multiplying the signal by two would have any effect.

Yeah. I mean , I think if you really have louder signals , what you mean is that you have  better signal - to - noise ratio.


Yeah. I mean , I think if you really have louder signals , what you mean is that you have  better signal - to - noise ratio.


Yeah. I mean , I think if you really have louder signals , what you mean is that you have  better signal - to - noise ratio.

So if what you 're doing is improving the signal - to - noise ratio , then it would be better.


So if what you 're doing is improving the signal - to - noise ratio , then it would be better.

But just it being bigger if  with the same signal - to - noise ratio


But just it being bigger if  with the same signal - to - noise ratio


Well , the system is  use  the absolute energy , so it 's a little bit dependent on  on the  signal level. But , not so much , I guess.


Well , the system is  use  the absolute energy , so it 's a little bit dependent on  on the  signal level. But , not so much , I guess.

Well , yeah. But it 's trained and tested on the same thing.


Well , the system is  use  the absolute energy , so it 's a little bit dependent on  on the  signal level. But , not so much , I guess.

Well , yeah. But it 's trained and tested on the same thing.

So if the  if the  if you change  in both training and test , the absolute level by a factor of two , it will n have no effect.


Well , yeah. But it 's trained and tested on the same thing.

So if the  if the  if you change  in both training and test , the absolute level by a factor of two , it will n have no effect.


So if the  if the  if you change  in both training and test , the absolute level by a factor of two , it will n have no effect.

Did you add  this data to the training set , for the Aurora ? Or you just tested on this ?


Did you add  this data to the training set , for the Aurora ? Or you just tested on this ?

Well , Morgan was just saying that , uh , as long as you do it in both training and testing , it shouldn't have any effect.


Well , Morgan was just saying that , uh , as long as you do it in both training and testing , it shouldn't have any effect.

But I  I was  sort of under the impression that you just tested with this data.


But I  I was  sort of under the impression that you just tested with this data.


But I  I was  sort of under the impression that you just tested with this data.

I  Right. I trained on clean TI - digits. I  I did the mean subtraction on clean TI - digits. But I didn't  I 'm not sure if it made the clean ti TI - digits any louder.


I  Right. I trained on clean TI - digits. I  I did the mean subtraction on clean TI - digits. But I didn't  I 'm not sure if it made the clean ti TI - digits any louder.


I  Right. I trained on clean TI - digits. I  I did the mean subtraction on clean TI - digits. But I didn't  I 'm not sure if it made the clean ti TI - digits any louder.

I only remember noticing it made the , um , PZM signal louder.


I  Right. I trained on clean TI - digits. I  I did the mean subtraction on clean TI - digits. But I didn't  I 'm not sure if it made the clean ti TI - digits any louder.

I only remember noticing it made the , um , PZM signal louder.

OK. Well , I don't understand then. Yeah.


I only remember noticing it made the , um , PZM signal louder.

OK. Well , I don't understand then. Yeah.

Huh. I don't know. If it 's  if it 's  like , if it 's trying to find a  a reverberation filter , it could be that this reverberation filter is making things quieter. And then if you take it out  that taking it out makes things louder. I mean.


I only remember noticing it made the , um , PZM signal louder.

OK. Well , I don't understand then. Yeah.

Huh. I don't know. If it 's  if it 's  like , if it 's trying to find a  a reverberation filter , it could be that this reverberation filter is making things quieter. And then if you take it out  that taking it out makes things louder. I mean.

Uh , no. I mean ,  uh , there 's  there 's nothing inherent about removing  if you 're really removing ,


OK. Well , I don't understand then. Yeah.

Huh. I don't know. If it 's  if it 's  like , if it 's trying to find a  a reverberation filter , it could be that this reverberation filter is making things quieter. And then if you take it out  that taking it out makes things louder. I mean.

Uh , no. I mean ,  uh , there 's  there 's nothing inherent about removing  if you 're really removing ,


Huh. I don't know. If it 's  if it 's  like , if it 's trying to find a  a reverberation filter , it could be that this reverberation filter is making things quieter. And then if you take it out  that taking it out makes things louder. I mean.

Uh , no. I mean ,  uh , there 's  there 's nothing inherent about removing  if you 're really removing ,

uh , r uh , then I don't  see how that would make it louder.


Uh , no. I mean ,  uh , there 's  there 's nothing inherent about removing  if you 're really removing ,

uh , r uh , then I don't  see how that would make it louder.


uh , r uh , then I don't  see how that would make it louder.


uh , r uh , then I don't  see how that would make it louder.

Yeah. OK. So I should maybe listen to that stuff again.


Yeah. OK. So I should maybe listen to that stuff again.

Yeah. It might just be some artifact of the processing that  that , uh , if you 're  Uh , yeah. I don't know.


Yeah. OK. So I should maybe listen to that stuff again.

Yeah. It might just be some artifact of the processing that  that , uh , if you 're  Uh , yeah. I don't know.

I wonder if there could be something like , uh  for s for the PZM data ,


Yeah. It might just be some artifact of the processing that  that , uh , if you 're  Uh , yeah. I don't know.

I wonder if there could be something like , uh  for s for the PZM data ,


I wonder if there could be something like , uh  for s for the PZM data ,

uh , you know , if occasionally , uh , somebody hits the table or something , you could get a spike. Uh. I 'm just wondering if there 's something about the , um  you know , doing the mean normalization where , uh , it  it could cause  you to have better signal - to - noise ratio. Um.


I wonder if there could be something like , uh  for s for the PZM data ,

uh , you know , if occasionally , uh , somebody hits the table or something , you could get a spike. Uh. I 'm just wondering if there 's something about the , um  you know , doing the mean normalization where , uh , it  it could cause  you to have better signal - to - noise ratio. Um.

Well , you know , there is this. Wait a minute. It  it  i maybe  i If , um  Subtracting the  the mean log spectrum is  is  is like dividing by the spectrum. So , depending what you divide by , if your  if s your estimate is off and sometimes you 're  you 're  you 're getting a small number , you could make it bigger.


uh , you know , if occasionally , uh , somebody hits the table or something , you could get a spike. Uh. I 'm just wondering if there 's something about the , um  you know , doing the mean normalization where , uh , it  it could cause  you to have better signal - to - noise ratio. Um.

Well , you know , there is this. Wait a minute. It  it  i maybe  i If , um  Subtracting the  the mean log spectrum is  is  is like dividing by the spectrum. So , depending what you divide by , if your  if s your estimate is off and sometimes you 're  you 're  you 're getting a small number , you could make it bigger.


Well , you know , there is this. Wait a minute. It  it  i maybe  i If , um  Subtracting the  the mean log spectrum is  is  is like dividing by the spectrum. So , depending what you divide by , if your  if s your estimate is off and sometimes you 're  you 're  you 're getting a small number , you could make it bigger.

So , it 's  it 's just a  a question of  there 's  It  it could be that there 's some normalization that 's missing , or something to make it


So , it 's  it 's just a  a question of  there 's  It  it could be that there 's some normalization that 's missing , or something to make it


So , it 's  it 's just a  a question of  there 's  It  it could be that there 's some normalization that 's missing , or something to make it

Uh , y you 'd think it shouldn't be larger , but maybe in practice it is. That 's something to think about.


Uh , y you 'd think it shouldn't be larger , but maybe in practice it is. That 's something to think about.


Uh , y you 'd think it shouldn't be larger , but maybe in practice it is. That 's something to think about.

I had a question about the system  the SRI system. So ,  you trained it on TI - digits ? But except this , it 's exactly the same system as the one that was tested before and that was trained on  Macrophone. Right ? So on TI - digits it gives you one point two percent error rate and on Macrophone it 's still O point eight. Uh , but is it  exactly the same system ?


I had a question about the system  the SRI system. So ,  you trained it on TI - digits ? But except this , it 's exactly the same system as the one that was tested before and that was trained on  Macrophone. Right ? So on TI - digits it gives you one point two percent error rate and on Macrophone it 's still O point eight. Uh , but is it  exactly the same system ?


I had a question about the system  the SRI system. So ,  you trained it on TI - digits ? But except this , it 's exactly the same system as the one that was tested before and that was trained on  Macrophone. Right ? So on TI - digits it gives you one point two percent error rate and on Macrophone it 's still O point eight. Uh , but is it  exactly the same system ?

If you 're talking about the Macrophone results that Andreas had about , um , a week and a half ago , I think it 's the same system.


If you 're talking about the Macrophone results that Andreas had about , um , a week and a half ago , I think it 's the same system.

Mm - hmm. So you use VTL - uh , vocal tract length normalization and , um , like MLLR transformations also ,


Mm - hmm. So you use VTL - uh , vocal tract length normalization and , um , like MLLR transformations also ,

I 'm sorry , was his point eight percent , er , a  a result on testing on Macrophone or  or training ?


I 'm sorry , was his point eight percent , er , a  a result on testing on Macrophone or  or training ?


I 'm sorry , was his point eight percent , er , a  a result on testing on Macrophone or  or training ?

It was  training on Macrophone and testing  yeah , on  on meeting digits.


It was  training on Macrophone and testing  yeah , on  on meeting digits.

Oh. So that was done already. So we were  Uh , and it 's point eight ? OK.


Oh. So that was done already. So we were  Uh , and it 's point eight ? OK.

Yeah. I  I 've just been text  testing the new  Aurora front - end with  well , Aurora system actually  so front - end and HTK , um , acoustic models on the meeting digits and it 's a little bit better than the previous system. We have  I have two point seven percent error rate. And before with the system that was proposed , it 's what ? It was three point nine. So.


Yeah. I  I 've just been text  testing the new  Aurora front - end with  well , Aurora system actually  so front - end and HTK , um , acoustic models on the meeting digits and it 's a little bit better than the previous system. We have  I have two point seven percent error rate. And before with the system that was proposed , it 's what ? It was three point nine. So.


With the  with the HTK back - end ? What we have for Aurora ?


we have  the new LDA filters , and  I think , maybe  I didn't look , but one thing that makes a difference is this DC offset compensation. Uh , eh  Do y did you have a look at  at the meet uh , meeting digits , if they have a DC component , or  ?


No. The DC component could be negligible. I mean , if you are  recording it through a mike. I mean , any  all of the mikes have the DC removal  some capacitor sitting right in  that bias it.


No. The DC component could be negligible. I mean , if you are  recording it through a mike. I mean , any  all of the mikes have the DC removal  some capacitor sitting right in  that bias it.

Yeah. But this  uh , uh , uh , no. Because , uh , there 's a sample and hold in the A - toD. And these period these typically do have a DC offset.


No. The DC component could be negligible. I mean , if you are  recording it through a mike. I mean , any  all of the mikes have the DC removal  some capacitor sitting right in  that bias it.

Yeah. But this  uh , uh , uh , no. Because , uh , there 's a sample and hold in the A - toD. And these period these typically do have a DC offset.

And  and they can be surprisingly large. It depends on the electronics.


Yeah. But this  uh , uh , uh , no. Because , uh , there 's a sample and hold in the A - toD. And these period these typically do have a DC offset.

And  and they can be surprisingly large. It depends on the electronics.

Oh , so it is the digital  OK. It 's the A - toD that introduces the DC in.


And  and they can be surprisingly large. It depends on the electronics.

Oh , so it is the digital  OK. It 's the A - toD that introduces the DC in.

Yeah. The microphone isn't gonna pass any DC.


Oh , so it is the digital  OK. It 's the A - toD that introduces the DC in.

Yeah. The microphone isn't gonna pass any DC.


Yeah. The microphone isn't gonna pass any DC.


typi you know , unless  Actually , there are  instrumentation mikes that  that do pass  go down to DC. But  but ,


typi you know , unless  Actually , there are  instrumentation mikes that  that do pass  go down to DC. But  but ,

uh , no , it 's the electronics. And they  and


uh , no , it 's the electronics. And they  and

then there 's amplification afterwards. And you can get , I think it was  I think it was in the  Wall Street Journal data that  that  I can't remember , one of the DARPA things. There was this big DC - DC offset


then there 's amplification afterwards. And you can get , I think it was  I think it was in the  Wall Street Journal data that  that  I can't remember , one of the DARPA things. There was this big DC - DC offset

we didn't  we didn't know about for a while , while we were  messing with it. And we were getting these terrible results. And then we were talking to somebody and they said , " Oh , yeah. Didn't you know ? Everybody knows that. There 's all this DC offset in th " So , yes. You can have DC offset in the data.


we didn't  we didn't know about for a while , while we were  messing with it. And we were getting these terrible results. And then we were talking to somebody and they said , " Oh , yeah. Didn't you know ? Everybody knows that. There 's all this DC offset in th " So , yes. You can have DC offset in the data.


So was that  was that everything , Dave ?


So was that  was that everything , Dave ?

Oh. And I also , um , did some experiments  about normalizing the phase. Um. So I c I came up with a web page that people can take a look at. And , um , the interesting thing that I tried was , um , Adam and Morgan had this idea , um , since my original attempts to , um , take the mean of the phase spectra over time and normalize using that , by subtracting that off , didn't work. Um , so , well , that we thought that might be due to , um , problems with , um , the arithmetic of phases. They  they add in this modulo two pi way and , um , there 's reason to believe that that approach of taking the mean of the phase spectrum wasn't really  mathematically correct. So ,  what I did instead is I  took the mean of the FFT spectrum without taking the log or anything , and then I took the phase of that , and I subtracted that phase  off to normalize. But that , um , didn't work either.


So was that  was that everything , Dave ?

Oh. And I also , um , did some experiments  about normalizing the phase. Um. So I c I came up with a web page that people can take a look at. And , um , the interesting thing that I tried was , um , Adam and Morgan had this idea , um , since my original attempts to , um , take the mean of the phase spectra over time and normalize using that , by subtracting that off , didn't work. Um , so , well , that we thought that might be due to , um , problems with , um , the arithmetic of phases. They  they add in this modulo two pi way and , um , there 's reason to believe that that approach of taking the mean of the phase spectrum wasn't really  mathematically correct. So ,  what I did instead is I  took the mean of the FFT spectrum without taking the log or anything , and then I took the phase of that , and I subtracted that phase  off to normalize. But that , um , didn't work either.

See , we have a different interpretation of this. He says it doesn't work. I said , I think it works magnificently , but just not for the task we intended. Uh , it gets rid of the speech.


Oh. And I also , um , did some experiments  about normalizing the phase. Um. So I c I came up with a web page that people can take a look at. And , um , the interesting thing that I tried was , um , Adam and Morgan had this idea , um , since my original attempts to , um , take the mean of the phase spectra over time and normalize using that , by subtracting that off , didn't work. Um , so , well , that we thought that might be due to , um , problems with , um , the arithmetic of phases. They  they add in this modulo two pi way and , um , there 's reason to believe that that approach of taking the mean of the phase spectrum wasn't really  mathematically correct. So ,  what I did instead is I  took the mean of the FFT spectrum without taking the log or anything , and then I took the phase of that , and I subtracted that phase  off to normalize. But that , um , didn't work either.

See , we have a different interpretation of this. He says it doesn't work. I said , I think it works magnificently , but just not for the task we intended. Uh , it gets rid of the speech.


See , we have a different interpretation of this. He says it doesn't work. I said , I think it works magnificently , but just not for the task we intended. Uh , it gets rid of the speech.

Uh , it leaves  you know , it leaves the junk. I mean , I  I think it 's  it 's tremendous.


Uh , it leaves  you know , it leaves the junk. I mean , I  I think it 's  it 's tremendous.


Uh , it leaves  you know , it leaves the junk. I mean , I  I think it 's  it 's tremendous.

You see , all he has to do is go back and reverse what he did before , and he 's really got something.


Uh , it leaves  you know , it leaves the junk. I mean , I  I think it 's  it 's tremendous.

You see , all he has to do is go back and reverse what he did before , and he 's really got something.

Well , could you take what was left over and then subtract that ?


You see , all he has to do is go back and reverse what he did before , and he 's really got something.

Well , could you take what was left over and then subtract that ?


Well , could you take what was left over and then subtract that ?


Just listen very carefully to what I say and do the opposite. Including what I just said.


Just listen very carefully to what I say and do the opposite. Including what I just said.

All set ? Do you want to go , Stephane ?


Just listen very carefully to what I say and do the opposite. Including what I just said.

All set ? Do you want to go , Stephane ?

Um. Yeah. Maybe , concerning these d still , these meeting digits. I 'm more interested in trying to figure out what 's still the difference between the SRI system and the Aurora system. And  Um. Yeah. So , I think I will maybe train , like , gender - dependent models , because  this is also one big difference between  the two systems. Um , the other differences were  the fact that maybe the acoustic models of the SRI are more  SRI system are more complex. But , uh , Chuck , you did some experiments with this and


All set ? Do you want to go , Stephane ?

Um. Yeah. Maybe , concerning these d still , these meeting digits. I 'm more interested in trying to figure out what 's still the difference between the SRI system and the Aurora system. And  Um. Yeah. So , I think I will maybe train , like , gender - dependent models , because  this is also one big difference between  the two systems. Um , the other differences were  the fact that maybe the acoustic models of the SRI are more  SRI system are more complex. But , uh , Chuck , you did some experiments with this and

It didn't seem to help in the HTK system.


All set ? Do you want to go , Stephane ?

Um. Yeah. Maybe , concerning these d still , these meeting digits. I 'm more interested in trying to figure out what 's still the difference between the SRI system and the Aurora system. And  Um. Yeah. So , I think I will maybe train , like , gender - dependent models , because  this is also one big difference between  the two systems. Um , the other differences were  the fact that maybe the acoustic models of the SRI are more  SRI system are more complex. But , uh , Chuck , you did some experiments with this and

It didn't seem to help in the HTK system.

it was hard t to  to have some exper some improvement with this. Um.


Um. Yeah. Maybe , concerning these d still , these meeting digits. I 'm more interested in trying to figure out what 's still the difference between the SRI system and the Aurora system. And  Um. Yeah. So , I think I will maybe train , like , gender - dependent models , because  this is also one big difference between  the two systems. Um , the other differences were  the fact that maybe the acoustic models of the SRI are more  SRI system are more complex. But , uh , Chuck , you did some experiments with this and

It didn't seem to help in the HTK system.

it was hard t to  to have some exper some improvement with this. Um.

Well , it sounds like they also have  he  he 's saying they have all these , uh , uh , different kinds of adaptation.


It didn't seem to help in the HTK system.

it was hard t to  to have some exper some improvement with this. Um.

Well , it sounds like they also have  he  he 's saying they have all these , uh , uh , different kinds of adaptation.


it was hard t to  to have some exper some improvement with this. Um.

Well , it sounds like they also have  he  he 's saying they have all these , uh , uh , different kinds of adaptation.

You know , they have channel adaptation. They have speaker adaptation.


Well , it sounds like they also have  he  he 's saying they have all these , uh , uh , different kinds of adaptation.

You know , they have channel adaptation. They have speaker adaptation.


You know , they have channel adaptation. They have speaker adaptation.


Like they do , um  I 'm not sure how they would do it when they 're working with the digits ,


Like they do , um  I 'm not sure how they would do it when they 're working with the digits ,

but , like , in the Switchboard data , there 's , um  conversation - side normalization for the  non - C - zero components ,


Like they do , um  I 'm not sure how they would do it when they 're working with the digits ,

but , like , in the Switchboard data , there 's , um  conversation - side normalization for the  non - C - zero components ,

Yeah. Yeah. This is another difference. Their normalization works like on  on the utterance levels.


but , like , in the Switchboard data , there 's , um  conversation - side normalization for the  non - C - zero components ,

Yeah. Yeah. This is another difference. Their normalization works like on  on the utterance levels.


but , like , in the Switchboard data , there 's , um  conversation - side normalization for the  non - C - zero components ,

Yeah. Yeah. This is another difference. Their normalization works like on  on the utterance levels.

But we have to do it  We have a system that does it on - line.


Yeah. Yeah. This is another difference. Their normalization works like on  on the utterance levels.

But we have to do it  We have a system that does it on - line.


But we have to do it  We have a system that does it on - line.

So , it might be  it might be better with  it might be worse if the  channel is constant ,


So , it might be  it might be better with  it might be worse if the  channel is constant ,


So , it might be  it might be better with  it might be worse if the  channel is constant ,

And the acoustic models are like - k triphone models or  or is it the whole word ?


And the acoustic models are like - k triphone models or  or is it the whole word ?


I mean , so they  they have  I  I thin think they use these , uh , uh , genone things. So there 's  there 's these kind of , uh , uh , pooled models and  and they can go out to all sorts of dependencies.


They have tied states and I think  I  I  I don't real I 'm talk I 'm just guessing here. But I think  I think they  they don't just have triphones.


They have tied states and I think  I  I  I don't real I 'm talk I 'm just guessing here. But I think  I think they  they don't just have triphones.

I think they have a range of  of , uh , dependencies.


I think they have a range of  of , uh , dependencies.


And  Yeah. Well. Um. Well , the first thing I  that I want to do is just maybe these gender things. Uh. And maybe see with  Andreas if  Well , I  I don't know  how much it helps , what 's the model.


And  Yeah. Well. Um. Well , the first thing I  that I want to do is just maybe these gender things. Uh. And maybe see with  Andreas if  Well , I  I don't know  how much it helps , what 's the model.

So  so the n stuff on the numbers you got , the two point seven , is that using the same training data that the SRI system used and got one point two ?


And  Yeah. Well. Um. Well , the first thing I  that I want to do is just maybe these gender things. Uh. And maybe see with  Andreas if  Well , I  I don't know  how much it helps , what 's the model.

So  so the n stuff on the numbers you got , the two point seven , is that using the same training data that the SRI system used and got one point two ?

That 's right. So it 's the clean  TI - digits training set.


So  so the n stuff on the numbers you got , the two point seven , is that using the same training data that the SRI system used and got one point two ?

That 's right. So it 's the clean  TI - digits training set.


That 's right. So it 's the clean  TI - digits training set.


Mm - hmm. I guess you used the clean training set.


You know , the  the Aurora baseline is set up with these , um   this version of the clean training set that 's been filtered with this G - seven - one - two filter , and , um , to train the SRI system on digits S - Andreas used the original TI - digits , um , under U doctor - speech data TI - digits , which don't have this filter. But I don't think there 's any other difference.