Mm - hmm. Um , yep. Uh , and another thing is to  Yeah , for this I just use as noise estimate the mean , uh , spectrum of the first twenty frames of each utterance. I don't remember for this experiment what did you use for these two stage

I used ten  just ten frames. Yeah , because

I mean , the reason was like in TI - digits I don't have a lot. I had twenty frames most of the time.


I used ten  just ten frames. Yeah , because

I mean , the reason was like in TI - digits I don't have a lot. I had twenty frames most of the time.

Mm - hmm. Um. But , so what 's this result you told me about , the fact that if you use more than ten frames you can  improve by t


I mean , the reason was like in TI - digits I don't have a lot. I had twenty frames most of the time.

Mm - hmm. Um. But , so what 's this result you told me about , the fact that if you use more than ten frames you can  improve by t

Well , that 's  that 's using the channel zero. If I use a channel zero VAD to estimate the noise.


Mm - hmm. Um. But , so what 's this result you told me about , the fact that if you use more than ten frames you can  improve by t

Well , that 's  that 's using the channel zero. If I use a channel zero VAD to estimate the noise.


Well , that 's  that 's using the channel zero. If I use a channel zero VAD to estimate the noise.


Uh , no , these results with two stage Wiener filtering is ten frames


Uh , no , these results with two stage Wiener filtering is ten frames

but possibly more. I mean , if channel one VAD gives you


but possibly more. I mean , if channel one VAD gives you

Yeah. OK. Yeah , but in this experiment I did  I didn't use any VAD. I just used the twenty first frame to estimate the noise. And  So I expected it to be a little bit better ,  if , uh , I use more  more frames. Um. OK , that 's it for spectral subtraction. The second thing I was working on is to , um , try to look at noise estimation ,  mmm , and using some technique that doesn't need voice activity detection. Um , and for this I u simply used some code that , uh ,  I had from  from Belgium , which is technique that , um , takes a bunch of frame , um , and for each frequency bands of this frame , takes a look at the minima of the energy. And then average these minima and take this as an  an energy estimate of the noise for this particular frequency band. And there is something more to this actually. What is done is that ,  uh , these minima are computed , um , based on , um , high resolution spectra. So , I compute an FFT based on the long , uh , signal frame which is sixty - four millisecond


but possibly more. I mean , if channel one VAD gives you

Yeah. OK. Yeah , but in this experiment I did  I didn't use any VAD. I just used the twenty first frame to estimate the noise. And  So I expected it to be a little bit better ,  if , uh , I use more  more frames. Um. OK , that 's it for spectral subtraction. The second thing I was working on is to , um , try to look at noise estimation ,  mmm , and using some technique that doesn't need voice activity detection. Um , and for this I u simply used some code that , uh ,  I had from  from Belgium , which is technique that , um , takes a bunch of frame , um , and for each frequency bands of this frame , takes a look at the minima of the energy. And then average these minima and take this as an  an energy estimate of the noise for this particular frequency band. And there is something more to this actually. What is done is that ,  uh , these minima are computed , um , based on , um , high resolution spectra. So , I compute an FFT based on the long , uh , signal frame which is sixty - four millisecond

So you have one minimum for each frequency ?


Yeah. OK. Yeah , but in this experiment I did  I didn't use any VAD. I just used the twenty first frame to estimate the noise. And  So I expected it to be a little bit better ,  if , uh , I use more  more frames. Um. OK , that 's it for spectral subtraction. The second thing I was working on is to , um , try to look at noise estimation ,  mmm , and using some technique that doesn't need voice activity detection. Um , and for this I u simply used some code that , uh ,  I had from  from Belgium , which is technique that , um , takes a bunch of frame , um , and for each frequency bands of this frame , takes a look at the minima of the energy. And then average these minima and take this as an  an energy estimate of the noise for this particular frequency band. And there is something more to this actually. What is done is that ,  uh , these minima are computed , um , based on , um , high resolution spectra. So , I compute an FFT based on the long , uh , signal frame which is sixty - four millisecond

So you have one minimum for each frequency ?

What  what I  what I d uh , I do actually , is to take a bunch of  to take a tile on the spectrogram and this tile is five hundred milliseconds long and two hundred hertz wide.


So you have one minimum for each frequency ?

What  what I  what I d uh , I do actually , is to take a bunch of  to take a tile on the spectrogram and this tile is five hundred milliseconds long and two hundred hertz wide.

And this tile  Uh , in this tile appears , like , the harmonics if you have a voiced sound , because it 's  it 's the FTT bins. And when you take the m the minima of  of these  this tile , when you don't have speech , these minima will give you some noise level estimate , If you have voiced speech , these minima will still give you some noise estimate because the minima are between the harmonics. And  If you have other  other kind of speech sounds then it 's not the case , but if the time frame is long enough , uh , like s five hundred milliseconds seems to be long enough ,  you still have portions which , uh , are very close  whi which minima are very close to the noise energy.


What  what I  what I d uh , I do actually , is to take a bunch of  to take a tile on the spectrogram and this tile is five hundred milliseconds long and two hundred hertz wide.

And this tile  Uh , in this tile appears , like , the harmonics if you have a voiced sound , because it 's  it 's the FTT bins. And when you take the m the minima of  of these  this tile , when you don't have speech , these minima will give you some noise level estimate , If you have voiced speech , these minima will still give you some noise estimate because the minima are between the harmonics. And  If you have other  other kind of speech sounds then it 's not the case , but if the time frame is long enough , uh , like s five hundred milliseconds seems to be long enough ,  you still have portions which , uh , are very close  whi which minima are very close to the noise energy.

I 'm confused. You said five hundred milliseconds


And this tile  Uh , in this tile appears , like , the harmonics if you have a voiced sound , because it 's  it 's the FTT bins. And when you take the m the minima of  of these  this tile , when you don't have speech , these minima will give you some noise level estimate , If you have voiced speech , these minima will still give you some noise estimate because the minima are between the harmonics. And  If you have other  other kind of speech sounds then it 's not the case , but if the time frame is long enough , uh , like s five hundred milliseconds seems to be long enough ,  you still have portions which , uh , are very close  whi which minima are very close to the noise energy.

I 'm confused. You said five hundred milliseconds


And this tile  Uh , in this tile appears , like , the harmonics if you have a voiced sound , because it 's  it 's the FTT bins. And when you take the m the minima of  of these  this tile , when you don't have speech , these minima will give you some noise level estimate , If you have voiced speech , these minima will still give you some noise estimate because the minima are between the harmonics. And  If you have other  other kind of speech sounds then it 's not the case , but if the time frame is long enough , uh , like s five hundred milliseconds seems to be long enough ,  you still have portions which , uh , are very close  whi which minima are very close to the noise energy.

I 'm confused. You said five hundred milliseconds

but you said sixty - four milliseconds. Which is which ? What ?


I 'm confused. You said five hundred milliseconds

but you said sixty - four milliseconds. Which is which ? What ?

Sixty - four milliseconds is to compute the FFT , uh , bins.


but you said sixty - four milliseconds. Which is which ? What ?

Sixty - four milliseconds is to compute the FFT , uh , bins.


Sixty - four milliseconds is to compute the FFT , uh , bins.


Um , actually it 's better to use sixty - four milliseconds because , um , if you use thirty milliseconds , then , uh , because of the  this short windowing and at low pitch , uh , sounds ,  the harmonics are not , wha uh , correctly separated.


Um , actually it 's better to use sixty - four milliseconds because , um , if you use thirty milliseconds , then , uh , because of the  this short windowing and at low pitch , uh , sounds ,  the harmonics are not , wha uh , correctly separated.

So if you take these minima , it  b  they will overestimate the noise a lot.


Um , actually it 's better to use sixty - four milliseconds because , um , if you use thirty milliseconds , then , uh , because of the  this short windowing and at low pitch , uh , sounds ,  the harmonics are not , wha uh , correctly separated.

So if you take these minima , it  b  they will overestimate the noise a lot.

So you take sixty - four millisecond F F Ts and then you average them  over five hundred ? Or  ? Uh , what do you do over five hundred ?


So if you take these minima , it  b  they will overestimate the noise a lot.

So you take sixty - four millisecond F F Ts and then you average them  over five hundred ? Or  ? Uh , what do you do over five hundred ?

So I take  to  I take a bunch of these sixty - four millisecond frame to cover five hundred milliseconds ,


So you take sixty - four millisecond F F Ts and then you average them  over five hundred ? Or  ? Uh , what do you do over five hundred ?

So I take  to  I take a bunch of these sixty - four millisecond frame to cover five hundred milliseconds ,


So I take  to  I take a bunch of these sixty - four millisecond frame to cover five hundred milliseconds ,


on the  on  on the bunch of uh fifty frames , right ?


on the  on  on the bunch of uh fifty frames , right ?

Mmm. So the interest of this is that , as y with this technique you can estimate u some reasonable noise spectra with only five hundred milliseconds of  of signal , so if the  the n the noise varies a lot , uh , you can track  better track the noise ,


Mmm. So the interest of this is that , as y with this technique you can estimate u some reasonable noise spectra with only five hundred milliseconds of  of signal , so if the  the n the noise varies a lot , uh , you can track  better track the noise ,

which is not the case if you rely on the voice activity detector. So even if there are no no speech pauses , you can track the noise level. The only requirement is that you must have , in these five hundred milliseconds segment ,  you must have voiced sound at least. Cuz this  these will help you to  to track the  the noise level. Um. So what I did is just to simply replace the VAD - based , uh , noise estimate by this estimate , first on SpeechDat - Car  Well , only on SpeechDat - Car actually. And it 's , uh , slightly worse , like one percent relative compared to the VAD - based  estimates. Um , I think the reason why it 's not better , is that the SpeechDat - Car noises are all stationary. Um. So , u y y there really is no need to have something that 's adaptive


which is not the case if you rely on the voice activity detector. So even if there are no no speech pauses , you can track the noise level. The only requirement is that you must have , in these five hundred milliseconds segment ,  you must have voiced sound at least. Cuz this  these will help you to  to track the  the noise level. Um. So what I did is just to simply replace the VAD - based , uh , noise estimate by this estimate , first on SpeechDat - Car  Well , only on SpeechDat - Car actually. And it 's , uh , slightly worse , like one percent relative compared to the VAD - based  estimates. Um , I think the reason why it 's not better , is that the SpeechDat - Car noises are all stationary. Um. So , u y y there really is no need to have something that 's adaptive

and  Uh , well , they are mainly stationary. Um. But , I expect s maybe some improvement on TI - digits because , nnn , in this case the noises are all sometimes very variable. Uh , so I have to test it. Mmm.


which is not the case if you rely on the voice activity detector. So even if there are no no speech pauses , you can track the noise level. The only requirement is that you must have , in these five hundred milliseconds segment ,  you must have voiced sound at least. Cuz this  these will help you to  to track the  the noise level. Um. So what I did is just to simply replace the VAD - based , uh , noise estimate by this estimate , first on SpeechDat - Car  Well , only on SpeechDat - Car actually. And it 's , uh , slightly worse , like one percent relative compared to the VAD - based  estimates. Um , I think the reason why it 's not better , is that the SpeechDat - Car noises are all stationary. Um. So , u y y there really is no need to have something that 's adaptive

and  Uh , well , they are mainly stationary. Um. But , I expect s maybe some improvement on TI - digits because , nnn , in this case the noises are all sometimes very variable. Uh , so I have to test it. Mmm.

But are you comparing with something  e I 'm  I 'm  p s a little confused again , i it  Uh , when you compare it with the V A D - based ,


and  Uh , well , they are mainly stationary. Um. But , I expect s maybe some improvement on TI - digits because , nnn , in this case the noises are all sometimes very variable. Uh , so I have to test it. Mmm.

But are you comparing with something  e I 'm  I 'm  p s a little confused again , i it  Uh , when you compare it with the V A D - based ,


But are you comparing with something  e I 'm  I 'm  p s a little confused again , i it  Uh , when you compare it with the V A D - based ,

It 's  It 's the France - Telecom - based spectra , s uh , Wiener filtering and VAD. So it 's their system but just I replace their noise estimate by this one.


It 's  It 's the France - Telecom - based spectra , s uh , Wiener filtering and VAD. So it 's their system but just I replace their noise estimate by this one.

Oh , you 're not doing this with our system ?


It 's  It 's the France - Telecom - based spectra , s uh , Wiener filtering and VAD. So it 's their system but just I replace their noise estimate by this one.

Oh , you 're not doing this with our system ?

In i I 'm not  No , no. Yeah , it 's our system but with just the Wiener filtering from their system. Right ? Mmm.


Oh , you 're not doing this with our system ?

In i I 'm not  No , no. Yeah , it 's our system but with just the Wiener filtering from their system. Right ? Mmm.

Yeah. Actually , th the best system that we still have is , uh , our system but with their noise compensation scheme , right ?


In i I 'm not  No , no. Yeah , it 's our system but with just the Wiener filtering from their system. Right ? Mmm.

Yeah. Actually , th the best system that we still have is , uh , our system but with their noise compensation scheme , right ?


Yeah. Actually , th the best system that we still have is , uh , our system but with their noise compensation scheme , right ?

So I 'm trying to improve on this , and  by  by replacing their noise estimate by , uh , something that might be better.


Yeah. Actually , th the best system that we still have is , uh , our system but with their noise compensation scheme , right ?

So I 'm trying to improve on this , and  by  by replacing their noise estimate by , uh , something that might be better.

OK. But the spectral subtraction scheme that you reported on also re requires a  a noise estimate.


So I 'm trying to improve on this , and  by  by replacing their noise estimate by , uh , something that might be better.

OK. But the spectral subtraction scheme that you reported on also re requires a  a noise estimate.


OK. But the spectral subtraction scheme that you reported on also re requires a  a noise estimate.


Not yet , because I did this in parallel ,


Yeah , for  for sure I will. I can try also , mmm , the spectral subtraction.


Yeah , for  for sure I will. I can try also , mmm , the spectral subtraction.

So I 'm also using that n new noise estimate technique on this Wiener filtering what I 'm trying.


Yeah , for  for sure I will. I can try also , mmm , the spectral subtraction.

So I 'm also using that n new noise estimate technique on this Wiener filtering what I 'm trying.

So I  I have , like , some experiments running , I don't have the results.


So I 'm also using that n new noise estimate technique on this Wiener filtering what I 'm trying.

So I  I have , like , some experiments running , I don't have the results.


So I  I have , like , some experiments running , I don't have the results.


I don't estimate the f noise on the ten frames but use his estimate.


I don't estimate the f noise on the ten frames but use his estimate.

Mm - hmm. Um. Yeah. I , um , also implemented a sp um  spectral whitening idea which is in the , um , Ericsson proposal. Uh , the idea is just to  um , flatten the log , uh , spectrum , um , and to flatten it more if the  the probability of silence is higher. So in this way , you can also reduce  somewhat reduce the musical noise and you reduce the variability if you have different noise shapes , because the  the spectrum becomes more flat in the silence portions. Um. Yeah. With this , no improvement , uh , but there are a lot of parameters that we can play with and , um  Actually , this  this could be seen as a soft version of the frame dropping because , um , you could just put the threshold and say that " below the threshold , I will flatten  comp completely flatten the  the spectrum ". And above this threshold , uh , keep the same spectrum. So it would be like frame dropping , because during the silence portions which are below the threshold of voice activity probability ,  uh , w you would have some kind of dummy frame which is a perfectly flat spectrum. And this , uh , whitening is something that 's more soft because , um , you whiten  you just , uh , have a function  the whitening is a function of the speech probability , so it 's not a hard decision.


Mm - hmm. Um. Yeah. I , um , also implemented a sp um  spectral whitening idea which is in the , um , Ericsson proposal. Uh , the idea is just to  um , flatten the log , uh , spectrum , um , and to flatten it more if the  the probability of silence is higher. So in this way , you can also reduce  somewhat reduce the musical noise and you reduce the variability if you have different noise shapes , because the  the spectrum becomes more flat in the silence portions. Um. Yeah. With this , no improvement , uh , but there are a lot of parameters that we can play with and , um  Actually , this  this could be seen as a soft version of the frame dropping because , um , you could just put the threshold and say that " below the threshold , I will flatten  comp completely flatten the  the spectrum ". And above this threshold , uh , keep the same spectrum. So it would be like frame dropping , because during the silence portions which are below the threshold of voice activity probability ,  uh , w you would have some kind of dummy frame which is a perfectly flat spectrum. And this , uh , whitening is something that 's more soft because , um , you whiten  you just , uh , have a function  the whitening is a function of the speech probability , so it 's not a hard decision.

Um , so I think maybe it can be used together with frame dropping and when we are not sure about if it 's speech or silence , well , maybe it has something do with this.


Mm - hmm. Um. Yeah. I , um , also implemented a sp um  spectral whitening idea which is in the , um , Ericsson proposal. Uh , the idea is just to  um , flatten the log , uh , spectrum , um , and to flatten it more if the  the probability of silence is higher. So in this way , you can also reduce  somewhat reduce the musical noise and you reduce the variability if you have different noise shapes , because the  the spectrum becomes more flat in the silence portions. Um. Yeah. With this , no improvement , uh , but there are a lot of parameters that we can play with and , um  Actually , this  this could be seen as a soft version of the frame dropping because , um , you could just put the threshold and say that " below the threshold , I will flatten  comp completely flatten the  the spectrum ". And above this threshold , uh , keep the same spectrum. So it would be like frame dropping , because during the silence portions which are below the threshold of voice activity probability ,  uh , w you would have some kind of dummy frame which is a perfectly flat spectrum. And this , uh , whitening is something that 's more soft because , um , you whiten  you just , uh , have a function  the whitening is a function of the speech probability , so it 's not a hard decision.

Um , so I think maybe it can be used together with frame dropping and when we are not sure about if it 's speech or silence , well , maybe it has something do with this.

It 's interesting. I mean , um , you know , in  in JRASTA we were essentially adding in , uh , white  uh , white noise dependent on our estimate of the noise.


Um , so I think maybe it can be used together with frame dropping and when we are not sure about if it 's speech or silence , well , maybe it has something do with this.

It 's interesting. I mean , um , you know , in  in JRASTA we were essentially adding in , uh , white  uh , white noise dependent on our estimate of the noise.


Um , so I think maybe it can be used together with frame dropping and when we are not sure about if it 's speech or silence , well , maybe it has something do with this.

It 's interesting. I mean , um , you know , in  in JRASTA we were essentially adding in , uh , white  uh , white noise dependent on our estimate of the noise.

On the overall estimate of the noise. Uh , I think it never occurred to us to use a probability in there.


It 's interesting. I mean , um , you know , in  in JRASTA we were essentially adding in , uh , white  uh , white noise dependent on our estimate of the noise.

On the overall estimate of the noise. Uh , I think it never occurred to us to use a probability in there.


On the overall estimate of the noise. Uh , I think it never occurred to us to use a probability in there.

You could imagine one that  that  that made use of where  where the amount that you added in was , uh , a function of the probability of it being s speech or noise.


On the overall estimate of the noise. Uh , I think it never occurred to us to use a probability in there.

You could imagine one that  that  that made use of where  where the amount that you added in was , uh , a function of the probability of it being s speech or noise.

Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm. Yeah , w Yeah , right now it 's a constant that just depending on the  the noise spectrum.


You could imagine one that  that  that made use of where  where the amount that you added in was , uh , a function of the probability of it being s speech or noise.

Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm. Yeah , w Yeah , right now it 's a constant that just depending on the  the noise spectrum.


Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm. Yeah , w Yeah , right now it 's a constant that just depending on the  the noise spectrum.


Cuz that  that brings in sort of powers of classifiers that we don't really have in , uh , this other estimate. So it could be  it could be interesting.


Cuz that  that brings in sort of powers of classifiers that we don't really have in , uh , this other estimate. So it could be  it could be interesting.

What  what  what point does the , uh , system stop recording ? How much


Cuz that  that brings in sort of powers of classifiers that we don't really have in , uh , this other estimate. So it could be  it could be interesting.

What  what  what point does the , uh , system stop recording ? How much

It 'll keep going till  I guess when they run out of disk space ,


What  what  what point does the , uh , system stop recording ? How much

It 'll keep going till  I guess when they run out of disk space ,


It 'll keep going till  I guess when they run out of disk space ,


Yeah. Uh  Yeah , so there are  with this technique there are some  I just did something exactly the same as  as the Ericsson proposal but , um ,  the probability of speech is not computed the same way. And I think , i for  yeah , for a lot of things , actually a g a good speech probability is important. Like for frame dropping you improve , like  you can improve from ten percent as Sunil showed , if you use the channel zero speech probabilities.


S so , yeah. Uh , so yeah , the next thing I started to do is to ,  uh , try to develop a better voice activity detector. And , um  I d um  yeah , for this I think we can maybe try to train the neural network for voice activity detection on all the data that we have , including all the SpeechDat - Car data. Um  And so I 'm starting to obtain alignments on these databases. Um , and the way I mi I do that is that I just use the HTK system but I train it only on the close - talking microphone. And then I aligned  I obtained the Viterbi alignment of the training utterances. Um  It seems to be , uh i Actually what I observed is that for Italian it doesn't seem  Th - there seems to be a problem.


S so , yeah. Uh , so yeah , the next thing I started to do is to ,  uh , try to develop a better voice activity detector. And , um  I d um  yeah , for this I think we can maybe try to train the neural network for voice activity detection on all the data that we have , including all the SpeechDat - Car data. Um  And so I 'm starting to obtain alignments on these databases. Um , and the way I mi I do that is that I just use the HTK system but I train it only on the close - talking microphone. And then I aligned  I obtained the Viterbi alignment of the training utterances. Um  It seems to be , uh i Actually what I observed is that for Italian it doesn't seem  Th - there seems to be a problem.

No. So , it doesn't seems to help by their use of channel zero or channel one.


S so , yeah. Uh , so yeah , the next thing I started to do is to ,  uh , try to develop a better voice activity detector. And , um  I d um  yeah , for this I think we can maybe try to train the neural network for voice activity detection on all the data that we have , including all the SpeechDat - Car data. Um  And so I 'm starting to obtain alignments on these databases. Um , and the way I mi I do that is that I just use the HTK system but I train it only on the close - talking microphone. And then I aligned  I obtained the Viterbi alignment of the training utterances. Um  It seems to be , uh i Actually what I observed is that for Italian it doesn't seem  Th - there seems to be a problem.

No. So , it doesn't seems to help by their use of channel zero or channel one.

Uh , you mean their d the frame dropping , right ? Yeah , it doesn't


No. So , it doesn't seems to help by their use of channel zero or channel one.

Uh , you mean their d the frame dropping , right ? Yeah , it doesn't

Yeah. Yeah. So , u but actually the VAD was trained on Italian also ,


Uh , you mean their d the frame dropping , right ? Yeah , it doesn't

Yeah. Yeah. So , u but actually the VAD was trained on Italian also ,


Uh , you mean their d the frame dropping , right ? Yeah , it doesn't

Yeah. Yeah. So , u but actually the VAD was trained on Italian also ,

so  Um , the c the current VAD that we have was trained on , uh , t SPINE , right ?


Yeah. Yeah. So , u but actually the VAD was trained on Italian also ,

so  Um , the c the current VAD that we have was trained on , uh , t SPINE , right ?


so  Um , the c the current VAD that we have was trained on , uh , t SPINE , right ?

Italian , and TI - digits with noise and


so  Um , the c the current VAD that we have was trained on , uh , t SPINE , right ?

Italian , and TI - digits with noise and

Uh , yeah. And it seems to work on Italian but not on the Finnish and Spanish data. So , maybe one reason is that s s Finnish and Spanish noise are different. And actually we observed  we listened to some of the utterances and sometimes for Finnish there is music in the recordings and strange things , right ?


Italian , and TI - digits with noise and

Uh , yeah. And it seems to work on Italian but not on the Finnish and Spanish data. So , maybe one reason is that s s Finnish and Spanish noise are different. And actually we observed  we listened to some of the utterances and sometimes for Finnish there is music in the recordings and strange things , right ?


Italian , and TI - digits with noise and

Uh , yeah. And it seems to work on Italian but not on the Finnish and Spanish data. So , maybe one reason is that s s Finnish and Spanish noise are different. And actually we observed  we listened to some of the utterances and sometimes for Finnish there is music in the recordings and strange things , right ?

Um  Yeah , so the idea was to train all the databases and obtain an alignment to train on these databases , and , um , also to , um , try different kind of features ,  uh , as input to the VAD network. And we came up with a bunch of features that we want to try like , um , the spectral slope , the , um , the degree o degree of voicing with the features that , uh , we started to develop with Carmen , um , e with , uh , the correlation between bands and different kind of features ,


Uh , yeah. And it seems to work on Italian but not on the Finnish and Spanish data. So , maybe one reason is that s s Finnish and Spanish noise are different. And actually we observed  we listened to some of the utterances and sometimes for Finnish there is music in the recordings and strange things , right ?

Um  Yeah , so the idea was to train all the databases and obtain an alignment to train on these databases , and , um , also to , um , try different kind of features ,  uh , as input to the VAD network. And we came up with a bunch of features that we want to try like , um , the spectral slope , the , um , the degree o degree of voicing with the features that , uh , we started to develop with Carmen , um , e with , uh , the correlation between bands and different kind of features ,


Um  Yeah , so the idea was to train all the databases and obtain an alignment to train on these databases , and , um , also to , um , try different kind of features ,  uh , as input to the VAD network. And we came up with a bunch of features that we want to try like , um , the spectral slope , the , um , the degree o degree of voicing with the features that , uh , we started to develop with Carmen , um , e with , uh , the correlation between bands and different kind of features ,


headphones that aren't so uncomfortable.

I think  Well , this should be off the record ,


I think  Well , this should be off the record ,


No. Um , I don't think they 're designed to be over your ears.


No. Um , I don't think they 're designed to be over your ears.

Yeah , I know. It just  it really hurts. It gives you a headache , like if you  On your temple


Yeah , I know. It just  it really hurts. It gives you a headache , like if you  On your temple


But I definitely  haven't figured it out.


But I definitely  haven't figured it out.

I guess I have to d stop doing this sigh of contentment , you know , after sipping cappuccino or something.


I guess I have to d stop doing this sigh of contentment , you know , after sipping cappuccino or something.


I guess I have to d stop doing this sigh of contentment , you know , after sipping cappuccino or something.

We know exactly how much you have left in your cup.


We know exactly how much you have left in your cup.


So , uh ,  what were we gonna talk about again ? So we said  we said data collection , which we 're doing.


So , uh ,  what were we gonna talk about again ? So we said  we said data collection , which we 're doing.

OK. Do we do th do you go around the room  and do names or anything ?


OK. Do we do th do you go around the room  and do names or anything ?


OK. Do we do th do you go around the room  and do names or anything ?

u usually we 've done that and also we 've s done digits as well , but I forgot to print any out. So. Besides with this big a group ,


u usually we 've done that and also we 've s done digits as well , but I forgot to print any out. So. Besides with this big a group ,

You can write them on the board , if you want.


u usually we 've done that and also we 've s done digits as well , but I forgot to print any out. So. Besides with this big a group ,

You can write them on the board , if you want.

No. I it 'd be even better with this big


You can write them on the board , if you want.

No. I it 'd be even better with this big


No. I it 'd be even better with this big


Y I think your  your  your thing  may be pointing in a funny direction. Sort of it 's  it helps if it points sort of upwards.


So that thing  the little  th that part should be pointing upwards.


Oh , yeah , the element , yeah , n should be as close to you  your mouth as possible.


Oh , yeah , the element , yeah , n should be as close to you  your mouth as possible.

That 's good. That kind of thing is good.


That 's good. That kind of thing is good.


Alright. So what we had  was that we were gonna talk about data collection , and , um , uh , you  you put up there data format ,


Alright. So what we had  was that we were gonna talk about data collection , and , um , uh , you  you put up there data format ,

and other tasks during data collection ,


Alright. So what we had  was that we were gonna talk about data collection , and , um , uh , you  you put up there data format ,

and other tasks during data collection ,

So , I think the goal  the goal was what can we do  how can you do the data collection differently to get


and other tasks during data collection ,

So , I think the goal  the goal was what can we do  how can you do the data collection differently to get


and other tasks during data collection ,

So , I think the goal  the goal was what can we do  how can you do the data collection differently to get

what can you add to it to get , um , some information that would be helpful for the user - interface design ? Like


So , I think the goal  the goal was what can we do  how can you do the data collection differently to get

what can you add to it to get , um , some information that would be helpful for the user - interface design ? Like


what can you add to it to get , um , some information that would be helpful for the user - interface design ? Like

Especially for querying. So , getting people to do queries afterwards , getting people to do summaries afterwards. Um.


what can you add to it to get , um , some information that would be helpful for the user - interface design ? Like

Especially for querying. So , getting people to do queries afterwards , getting people to do summaries afterwards. Um.

Well , one thing that came up in the morning  in the morning was the , um , i uh , if he  I , um  if he has  s I  I don't remember , Mister Lan - Doctor Landry ?


Especially for querying. So , getting people to do queries afterwards , getting people to do summaries afterwards. Um.

Well , one thing that came up in the morning  in the morning was the , um , i uh , if he  I , um  if he has  s I  I don't remember , Mister Lan - Doctor Landry ?


Especially for querying. So , getting people to do queries afterwards , getting people to do summaries afterwards. Um.

Well , one thing that came up in the morning  in the morning was the , um , i uh , if he  I , um  if he has  s I  I don't remember , Mister Lan - Doctor Landry ?

La - Landay ? So he has , um , these , uh , um , tsk  note - taking things ,


Well , one thing that came up in the morning  in the morning was the , um , i uh , if he  I , um  if he has  s I  I don't remember , Mister Lan - Doctor Landry ?

La - Landay ? So he has , um , these , uh , um , tsk  note - taking things ,


La - Landay ? So he has , um , these , uh , um , tsk  note - taking things ,

then that would sort of be a summary which you wouldn't have to solicit. y if  if we were able to  to do that.


La - Landay ? So he has , um , these , uh , um , tsk  note - taking things ,

then that would sort of be a summary which you wouldn't have to solicit. y if  if we were able to  to do that.

Well , if  if you actually take notes as a summary as opposed to n take notes in the sense of taking advantage of the time - stamps. So action item or uh , reminder to send this to so - and - so , blah - blah - blah.


then that would sort of be a summary which you wouldn't have to solicit. y if  if we were able to  to do that.

Well , if  if you actually take notes as a summary as opposed to n take notes in the sense of taking advantage of the time - stamps. So action item or uh , reminder to send this to so - and - so , blah - blah - blah.


then that would sort of be a summary which you wouldn't have to solicit. y if  if we were able to  to do that.

Well , if  if you actually take notes as a summary as opposed to n take notes in the sense of taking advantage of the time - stamps. So action item or uh , reminder to send this to so - and - so , blah - blah - blah.

So that wouldn't be a summary. That would just be  that would b relate to the query side.


Well , if  if you actually take notes as a summary as opposed to n take notes in the sense of taking advantage of the time - stamps. So action item or uh , reminder to send this to so - and - so , blah - blah - blah.

So that wouldn't be a summary. That would just be  that would b relate to the query side.

But if we had the CrossPads , we could ask people , you know , if  if something comes up  write it down and mark it   somehow ,


So that wouldn't be a summary. That would just be  that would b relate to the query side.

But if we had the CrossPads , we could ask people , you know , if  if something comes up  write it down and mark it   somehow ,


So that wouldn't be a summary. That would just be  that would b relate to the query side.

But if we had the CrossPads , we could ask people , you know , if  if something comes up  write it down and mark it   somehow ,

Right. I mean , we  because you 'd have several people with these pads , you could collect different things.


But if we had the CrossPads , we could ask people , you know , if  if something comes up  write it down and mark it   somehow ,

Right. I mean , we  because you 'd have several people with these pads , you could collect different things.


Right. I mean , we  because you 'd have several people with these pads , you could collect different things.


Right. I mean , we  because you 'd have several people with these pads , you could collect different things.

I mean , cuz I tend to take notes which are summaries. And so , you know


I mean , cuz I tend to take notes which are summaries. And so , you know

I mean , the down - side to that is that he sort of indicated that the , uh , quality of  the handwriting recognition was quite poor.


I mean , cuz I tend to take notes which are summaries. And so , you know

I mean , the down - side to that is that he sort of indicated that the , uh , quality of  the handwriting recognition was quite poor.

But that 's alright. I don't think there 'd be so many that you couldn't have someone clean it up


I mean , the down - side to that is that he sort of indicated that the , uh , quality of  the handwriting recognition was quite poor.

But that 's alright. I don't think there 'd be so many that you couldn't have someone clean it up


But that 's alright. I don't think there 'd be so many that you couldn't have someone clean it up


But that 's alright. I don't think there 'd be so many that you couldn't have someone clean it up

Yeah. We also could come up with some code for things that people want to do so that  for frequent things.


Yeah. We also could come up with some code for things that people want to do so that  for frequent things.


Yeah. We also could come up with some code for things that people want to do so that  for frequent things.

And the other things , people can write whatever they want. I mean , it 's to some extent , uh , for his benefit. So , if that  you know , if  if we just keep it simple then maybe it 's still useful.


And the other things , people can write whatever they want. I mean , it 's to some extent , uh , for his benefit. So , if that  you know , if  if we just keep it simple then maybe it 's still useful.


And the other things , people can write whatever they want. I mean , it 's to some extent , uh , for his benefit. So , if that  you know , if  if we just keep it simple then maybe it 's still useful.

I just realized we skipped the part that we were saying we were gonna do at the front where we each said who we were.


I just realized we skipped the part that we were saying we were gonna do at the front where we each said who we were.


I just realized we skipped the part that we were saying we were gonna do at the front where we each said who we were.

Right. I thought you did that on purpose.


Right. I thought you did that on purpose.

But anyway , shall we do the roll call ?


Right. I thought you did that on purpose.

But anyway , shall we do the roll call ?

No , not a No , I just  My mind went elsewhere. So , uh , yeah , I 'm Morgan , and where am I ? I 'm on channel three.


But anyway , shall we do the roll call ?

No , not a No , I just  My mind went elsewhere. So , uh , yeah , I 'm Morgan , and where am I ? I 'm on channel three.


But anyway , shall we do the roll call ?

No , not a No , I just  My mind went elsewhere. So , uh , yeah , I 'm Morgan , and where am I ? I 'm on channel three.

I 'm Jane Edwards , I think on channel B.


No , not a No , I just  My mind went elsewhere. So , uh , yeah , I 'm Morgan , and where am I ? I 'm on channel three.

I 'm Jane Edwards , I think on channel B.


I 'm Jane Edwards , I think on channel B.


Should we have used pseudo - names ? Should we do it a second time with pseudo No.  No.


Should we have used pseudo - names ? Should we do it a second time with pseudo No.  No.

And , uh , do you want to do the P D As and the  P Z


And , uh , do you want to do the P D As and the  P Z

Oh. PZM nearest , nearest , next nearest. Next one.


Oh. PZM nearest , nearest , next nearest. Next one.


PDM - right , PZA - right  PDA - right , PDA - left.


PDM - right , PZA - right  PDA - right , PDA - left.

Yeah , and eventually once this room gets a little more organized , the Jimlets  will be mounted under the table , and these guys will be permanently mounted somehow. You know , probably with double - sided tape , but  So. You  So we won't have to go through that.


Yeah , and eventually once this room gets a little more organized , the Jimlets  will be mounted under the table , and these guys will be permanently mounted somehow. You know , probably with double - sided tape , but  So. You  So we won't have to go through that.


Yeah , and eventually once this room gets a little more organized , the Jimlets  will be mounted under the table , and these guys will be permanently mounted somehow. You know , probably with double - sided tape , but  So. You  So we won't have to go through that.

I have a question on protocol in these meetings , which is when you say " Jimlet " and the person listening won't know what that is , sh shou How  how do we get  Is that important information ? You know , the Jimlet  I mean , the box that contains the


Yeah , and eventually once this room gets a little more organized , the Jimlets  will be mounted under the table , and these guys will be permanently mounted somehow. You know , probably with double - sided tape , but  So. You  So we won't have to go through that.

I have a question on protocol in these meetings , which is when you say " Jimlet " and the person listening won't know what that is , sh shou How  how do we get  Is that important information ? You know , the Jimlet  I mean , the box that contains the

Well , I mean , suppose we broaden out and go to a range of meetings besides just these internal ones. There 's gonna be lots of things that any group of people who know each other have in column  common  that we will not know.


I have a question on protocol in these meetings , which is when you say " Jimlet " and the person listening won't know what that is , sh shou How  how do we get  Is that important information ? You know , the Jimlet  I mean , the box that contains the

Well , I mean , suppose we broaden out and go to a range of meetings besides just these internal ones. There 's gonna be lots of things that any group of people who know each other have in column  common  that we will not know.


Well , I mean , suppose we broaden out and go to a range of meetings besides just these internal ones. There 's gonna be lots of things that any group of people who know each other have in column  common  that we will not know.


So the there will be jargon that we he There 'll be transcription errors.


I mean , we  we were originally gonna do this with VLSI design , and  and  and the reason we didn't go straight to that was because immediately ninety percent of what we heard would be  jargon to  to us. So.


I mean , we  we were originally gonna do this with VLSI design , and  and  and the reason we didn't go straight to that was because immediately ninety percent of what we heard would be  jargon to  to us. So.

Well , that was just one of the reasons. But , yeah , definitely.


Well , that was just one of the reasons. But , yeah , definitely.

That  that 's right. There were others of course. Yeah.


That  that 's right. There were others of course. Yeah.

OK , so we were on the data collection   and the summary issue.


That  that 's right. There were others of course. Yeah.

OK , so we were on the data collection   and the summary issue.

So , uh , u u So , actually there 's kind of three issues. There 's the CrossPad issue. Should we do it and , if so , what 'll we have them do ? Um , do we have s people write summaries ? Everybody or one person ? And then , do we ask people for how they would query things ? Is that


OK , so we were on the data collection   and the summary issue.

So , uh , u u So , actually there 's kind of three issues. There 's the CrossPad issue. Should we do it and , if so , what 'll we have them do ? Um , do we have s people write summaries ? Everybody or one person ? And then , do we ask people for how they would query things ? Is that

There 's  there 're sub - problems in that , in that where  or when do you actually ask them about that ?


So , uh , u u So , actually there 's kind of three issues. There 's the CrossPad issue. Should we do it and , if so , what 'll we have them do ? Um , do we have s people write summaries ? Everybody or one person ? And then , do we ask people for how they would query things ? Is that

There 's  there 're sub - problems in that , in that where  or when do you actually ask them about that ?


So , uh , u u So , actually there 's kind of three issues. There 's the CrossPad issue. Should we do it and , if so , what 'll we have them do ? Um , do we have s people write summaries ? Everybody or one person ? And then , do we ask people for how they would query things ? Is that

There 's  there 're sub - problems in that , in that where  or when do you actually ask them about that ?

I mean , that was  One thing I was thinking about was is that Dan said earlier that , you know , maybe two weeks later , which is when you would want to query these things , you might ask them then.


There 's  there 're sub - problems in that , in that where  or when do you actually ask them about that ?

I mean , that was  One thing I was thinking about was is that Dan said earlier that , you know , maybe two weeks later , which is when you would want to query these things , you might ask them then.


I mean , that was  One thing I was thinking about was is that Dan said earlier that , you know , maybe two weeks later , which is when you would want to query these things , you might ask them then.

But there 's a problem with that in that if  you 're not  If you don't have an interactive system , it 's gonna be hard to go beyond sort of the first level of question.


But there 's a problem with that in that if  you 're not  If you don't have an interactive system , it 's gonna be hard to go beyond sort of the first level of question.

Right. And furth id explore the data further.


Right. And furth id explore the data further.


which is , um , we certainly do want to branch out beyond , uh , uh , recording meetings about Meeting Recorder. And , uh , once we get out beyond our little group , the people 's motivation factor , uh , reduces enormously. And if we start giving them a bunch of other things to do , how  you know , we  we did n you know another meeting here for another group and  and , uh , they were fine with it. But if we 'd said , " OK , now all eight of you have to   have to come up with , uh , the summar "


which is , um , we certainly do want to branch out beyond , uh , uh , recording meetings about Meeting Recorder. And , uh , once we get out beyond our little group , the people 's motivation factor , uh , reduces enormously. And if we start giving them a bunch of other things to do , how  you know , we  we did n you know another meeting here for another group and  and , uh , they were fine with it. But if we 'd said , " OK , now all eight of you have to   have to come up with , uh , the summar "

Well , I asked them to and none of them did.


which is , um , we certainly do want to branch out beyond , uh , uh , recording meetings about Meeting Recorder. And , uh , once we get out beyond our little group , the people 's motivation factor , uh , reduces enormously. And if we start giving them a bunch of other things to do , how  you know , we  we did n you know another meeting here for another group and  and , uh , they were fine with it. But if we 'd said , " OK , now all eight of you have to   have to come up with , uh , the summar "

Well , I asked them to and none of them did.

So , I  I asked them to send me ideas for queries after the meeting


Well , I asked them to and none of them did.

So , I  I asked them to send me ideas for queries after the meeting


So , I  I asked them to send me ideas for queries after the meeting


So I didn't track them down and say " please do th do it now ". But , uh , no one spontaneously provided anything.


So I didn't track them down and say " please do th do it now ". But , uh , no one spontaneously provided anything.

I I 'm worried that if you did  even if you did push them into it , it  it  it might be semi - random ,


So I didn't track them down and say " please do th do it now ". But , uh , no one spontaneously provided anything.

I I 'm worried that if you did  even if you did push them into it , it  it  it might be semi - random ,

uh , as opposed to what you 'd really want to know if you were gonna use this thing.


I I 'm worried that if you did  even if you did push them into it , it  it  it might be semi - random ,

uh , as opposed to what you 'd really want to know if you were gonna use this thing.


uh , as opposed to what you 'd really want to know if you were gonna use this thing.


uh , as opposed to what you 'd really want to know if you were gonna use this thing.

I just don't know how else to generate the queries other than getting an expert to actually listen to the meeting and say " that 's important , that might be a query ".


I just don't know how else to generate the queries other than getting an expert to actually listen to the meeting and say " that 's important , that might be a query ".

Tsk. Well , there is this other thing which y which you were alluding to earlier , which is , um , there are certain key words like , you know , " action item " and things like that , which could be used in , uh , t to some degree finding the structure.


Tsk. Well , there is this other thing which y which you were alluding to earlier , which is , um , there are certain key words like , you know , " action item " and things like that , which could be used in , uh , t to some degree finding the structure.

And  and I also , um , was thinking , with reference to the n uh , note - taking , the advantage there is that you get structure without the person having to do something artificial later. And the fir third thing I wanted to say is the summaries afterwards , um , I think they should be recorded instead of written because I think that , um , it would take so long for people to write that I think you wouldn't get as good a summary.


And  and I also , um , was thinking , with reference to the n uh , note - taking , the advantage there is that you get structure without the person having to do something artificial later. And the fir third thing I wanted to say is the summaries afterwards , um , I think they should be recorded instead of written because I think that , um , it would take so long for people to write that I think you wouldn't get as good a summary.

How about this idea ? That normally at most meetings somebody is delegated to be a note - taker.


And  and I also , um , was thinking , with reference to the n uh , note - taking , the advantage there is that you get structure without the person having to do something artificial later. And the fir third thing I wanted to say is the summaries afterwards , um , I think they should be recorded instead of written because I think that , um , it would take so long for people to write that I think you wouldn't get as good a summary.

How about this idea ? That normally at most meetings somebody is delegated to be a note - taker.

And  So why don't we just use the notes that somebody takes ?


How about this idea ? That normally at most meetings somebody is delegated to be a note - taker.

And  So why don't we just use the notes that somebody takes ?


And  So why don't we just use the notes that somebody takes ?

I mean , that gives you a summary but it doesn't really  How do you generate queries from that ?


And  So why don't we just use the notes that somebody takes ?

I mean , that gives you a summary but it doesn't really  How do you generate queries from that ?

Well. But , I mean , maybe a summary is one of the things we 'd want from the output of the system.


I mean , that gives you a summary but it doesn't really  How do you generate queries from that ?

Well. But , I mean , maybe a summary is one of the things we 'd want from the output of the system.


Well. But , I mean , maybe a summary is one of the things we 'd want from the output of the system.

Right ? I mean , they 're something. It 's a  a kind of output you 'd like.


Right ? I mean , they 're something. It 's a  a kind of output you 'd like.


Right ? I mean , they 're something. It 's a  a kind of output you 'd like.

Uh , James and I were talking about this during one of the breaks. And the problem with that is , I 'm definitely going to do something with information retrieval even if it 's sort of not full full - bore what I 'm gonna do for my thesis.


Uh , James and I were talking about this during one of the breaks. And the problem with that is , I 'm definitely going to do something with information retrieval even if it 's sort of not full full - bore what I 'm gonna do for my thesis.

I 'm gonna do something. I 'm not gonna do anything with summarization. And so if someone wants to do that , that 's fine , but it 's not gonna be me.


Uh , James and I were talking about this during one of the breaks. And the problem with that is , I 'm definitely going to do something with information retrieval even if it 's sort of not full full - bore what I 'm gonna do for my thesis.

I 'm gonna do something. I 'm not gonna do anything with summarization. And so if someone wants to do that , that 's fine , but it 's not gonna be me.

Well , I think that we  I mean , the  the f the core thing is that you know once we get some of these issues nailed down , we need to do a bunch of recordings


I 'm gonna do something. I 'm not gonna do anything with summarization. And so if someone wants to do that , that 's fine , but it 's not gonna be me.

Well , I think that we  I mean , the  the f the core thing is that you know once we get some of these issues nailed down , we need to do a bunch of recordings


I 'm gonna do something. I 'm not gonna do anything with summarization. And so if someone wants to do that , that 's fine , but it 's not gonna be me.

Well , I think that we  I mean , the  the f the core thing is that you know once we get some of these issues nailed down , we need to do a bunch of recordings

and send them off to IBM and get a bunch of transcriptions even if they 're slightly flawed


Well , I think that we  I mean , the  the f the core thing is that you know once we get some of these issues nailed down , we need to do a bunch of recordings

and send them off to IBM and get a bunch of transcriptions even if they 're slightly flawed


and send them off to IBM and get a bunch of transcriptions even if they 're slightly flawed

or need some other  And then we 'll have some data there.


or need some other  And then we 'll have some data there.

And then , i i we can start l looking and thinking , what do we want to know about these things and  at the very least.


And then , i i we can start l looking and thinking , what do we want to know about these things and  at the very least.


And then , i i we can start l looking and thinking , what do we want to know about these things and  at the very least.

I actually want to say something about the note pad. So , if you could sense just when people are writing , and you tell them not to doodle , or try not to  be using that for other purposes ,  and each person has a note pad. They just get it when they come in the room. Then you c you can just have a fff  plot of wh you know , who 's writing when.


I actually want to say something about the note pad. So , if you could sense just when people are writing , and you tell them not to doodle , or try not to  be using that for other purposes ,  and each person has a note pad. They just get it when they come in the room. Then you c you can just have a fff  plot of wh you know , who 's writing when.


And , you can also have notes of the meeting. But I bet that 's  that will allow you to go into the  sort of the hot places where people are writing things down.


And , you can also have notes of the meeting. But I bet that 's  that will allow you to go into the  sort of the hot places where people are writing things down.

I mean , you can tell when you 're in a meeting when everybody stops to write something down that something was just said.


I mean , you can tell when you 're in a meeting when everybody stops to write something down that something was just said.


I mean , you can tell when you 're in a meeting when everybody stops to write something down that something was just said.

It may not be kept in the later summary , but at that point in time is was something that was important.


It may not be kept in the later summary , but at that point in time is was something that was important.


Or someone could just pu you could just put your hand on the pad


That 's a good idea but that doesn't  Maybe I 'm missing something , but that doesn't get to the question of how we come up with queries , right ?


That 's a good idea but that doesn't  Maybe I 'm missing something , but that doesn't get to the question of how we come up with queries , right ?

Well , then you can go to the points where the  you could actually go to those points in time and find out what they were talking about. And you r


That 's a good idea but that doesn't  Maybe I 'm missing something , but that doesn't get to the question of how we come up with queries , right ?

Well , then you can go to the points where the  you could actually go to those points in time and find out what they were talking about. And you r

Well , what it does is provide a different


Well , then you can go to the points where the  you could actually go to those points in time and find out what they were talking about. And you r

Well , what it does is provide a different


Well , what it does is provide a different


I  I think it 's an interesting thing. I don't think it gets at the  the queries per - se , but it does give us an information fusion sort of thing that , you know , you wanna i say " what were the hot - points of the meeting ? "


I  I think it 's an interesting thing. I don't think it gets at the  the queries per - se , but it does give us an information fusion sort of thing that , you know , you wanna i say " what were the hot - points of the meeting ? "

That  that 's what I mean , is that I think it gets at something interesting but if we were asking the question , which I thought we were , of  of  of , um , " how do we figure out what 's the nature of the queries that people are gonna want to ask of such a system ? " , knowing what 's important doesn't tell you what people are going to be asking.


That  that 's what I mean , is that I think it gets at something interesting but if we were asking the question , which I thought we were , of  of  of , um , " how do we figure out what 's the nature of the queries that people are gonna want to ask of such a system ? " , knowing what 's important doesn't tell you what people are going to be asking.


I think you could say they 're gonna ask about , uh , when  uh , when did so - and - so s talk about blah. And at least that gives you the word  that they might run a query on.


I think you could say they 're gonna ask about , uh , when  uh , when did so - and - so s talk about blah. And at least that gives you the word  that they might run a query on.

At least you can find the locations where there are maybe keywords


I think you could say they 're gonna ask about , uh , when  uh , when did so - and - so s talk about blah. And at least that gives you the word  that they might run a query on.

At least you can find the locations where there are maybe keywords

I mean , i this would tell you what the hit is ,


At least you can find the locations where there are maybe keywords

I mean , i this would tell you what the hit is ,


I mean , i this would tell you what the hit is ,


It 'll tell you the hit but not the query.


It 'll tell you the hit but not the query.

But I think  I think thinking about queries is a little bit dangerous right now.


It 'll tell you the hit but not the query.

But I think  I think thinking about queries is a little bit dangerous right now.

And so you could  you can generate a query from the hits ,


But I think  I think thinking about queries is a little bit dangerous right now.

And so you could  you can generate a query from the hits ,


And so you could  you can generate a query from the hits ,

We don't even know what  I mean , if you want to find out what any user will use , that might be true for one domain and one user ,


We don't even know what  I mean , if you want to find out what any user will use , that might be true for one domain and one user ,


We don't even know what  I mean , if you want to find out what any user will use , that might be true for one domain and one user ,

but I mean a different domain and a different user


but I mean a different domain and a different user

Yeah , but we 're just looking for a place to start with that


Yeah , but we 're just looking for a place to start with that

because , you know , th what  what  what James is gonna be doing is looking at the user - interface and he 's looking at the query in  in  i We  we have five hours of pilot data of the other stuff but we have zero hours of  of  of queries. So he 's just sort of going " where  where do I  where do I start ? "


Yeah , but we 're just looking for a place to start with that

because , you know , th what  what  what James is gonna be doing is looking at the user - interface and he 's looking at the query in  in  i We  we have five hours of pilot data of the other stuff but we have zero hours of  of  of queries. So he 's just sort of going " where  where do I  where do I start ? "

w Well , th you could do  I think the summaries actually may help get us there ,


because , you know , th what  what  what James is gonna be doing is looking at the user - interface and he 's looking at the query in  in  i We  we have five hours of pilot data of the other stuff but we have zero hours of  of  of queries. So he 's just sort of going " where  where do I  where do I start ? "

w Well , th you could do  I think the summaries actually may help get us there ,


because , you know , th what  what  what James is gonna be doing is looking at the user - interface and he 's looking at the query in  in  i We  we have five hours of pilot data of the other stuff but we have zero hours of  of  of queries. So he 's just sort of going " where  where do I  where do I start ? "

w Well , th you could do  I think the summaries actually may help get us there ,

for a couple reasons. One , if you have a summary  if you have a bunch of summaries , you can do a word frequency count and see what words come up in different types of meetings.


w Well , th you could do  I think the summaries actually may help get us there ,

for a couple reasons. One , if you have a summary  if you have a bunch of summaries , you can do a word frequency count and see what words come up in different types of meetings.


for a couple reasons. One , if you have a summary  if you have a bunch of summaries , you can do a word frequency count and see what words come up in different types of meetings.

So " action item " is gonna come up whether it 's a VLSI meeting , or speech meeting , or whatever. So words that come up in different types of meetings may be something that you would want to query about.


So " action item " is gonna come up whether it 's a VLSI meeting , or speech meeting , or whatever. So words that come up in different types of meetings may be something that you would want to query about.

Um , the second thing you could possibly do with it is just run a little pilot experiment with somebody saying " here 's a summary of a meeting , what questions might you want to ask about it to go back ? "


So " action item " is gonna come up whether it 's a VLSI meeting , or speech meeting , or whatever. So words that come up in different types of meetings may be something that you would want to query about.

Um , the second thing you could possibly do with it is just run a little pilot experiment with somebody saying " here 's a summary of a meeting , what questions might you want to ask about it to go back ? "

Yeah , I think that 's difficult because then they 're not gonna ask the questions that are in the summary.


Um , the second thing you could possibly do with it is just run a little pilot experiment with somebody saying " here 's a summary of a meeting , what questions might you want to ask about it to go back ? "

Yeah , I think that 's difficult because then they 're not gonna ask the questions that are in the summary.


Yeah , I think that 's difficult because then they 're not gonna ask the questions that are in the summary.

That 's one possi one possible scenario , though , is you have the summary ,


That 's one possi one possible scenario , though , is you have the summary ,


That 's one possi one possible scenario , though , is you have the summary ,

and you want to ask questions to get more detail.


That 's one possi one possible scenario , though , is you have the summary ,

and you want to ask questions to get more detail.

th Yeah , I think it has to be a participant. Well , it doesn't have to be. OK. So that  that is another use of Meeting Recorder that we haven't really talked about , which is for someone else , as opposed to as a  remembrance agent , which is what had been my primary thought in the information retrieval part of it would be. But , uh , I guess if you had a meeting participant , they could use the summary to refresh themselves about the meeting and then make up queries. But it 's not


and you want to ask questions to get more detail.

th Yeah , I think it has to be a participant. Well , it doesn't have to be. OK. So that  that is another use of Meeting Recorder that we haven't really talked about , which is for someone else , as opposed to as a  remembrance agent , which is what had been my primary thought in the information retrieval part of it would be. But , uh , I guess if you had a meeting participant , they could use the summary to refresh themselves about the meeting and then make up queries. But it 's not


and you want to ask questions to get more detail.

th Yeah , I think it has to be a participant. Well , it doesn't have to be. OK. So that  that is another use of Meeting Recorder that we haven't really talked about , which is for someone else , as opposed to as a  remembrance agent , which is what had been my primary thought in the information retrieval part of it would be. But , uh , I guess if you had a meeting participant , they could use the summary to refresh themselves about the meeting and then make up queries. But it 's not

I don't know how to do it if  until you have a system.


th Yeah , I think it has to be a participant. Well , it doesn't have to be. OK. So that  that is another use of Meeting Recorder that we haven't really talked about , which is for someone else , as opposed to as a  remembrance agent , which is what had been my primary thought in the information retrieval part of it would be. But , uh , I guess if you had a meeting participant , they could use the summary to refresh themselves about the meeting and then make up queries. But it 's not

I don't know how to do it if  until you have a system.

The summary is actually gonna drive the queries then.


I don't know how to do it if  until you have a system.

The summary is actually gonna drive the queries then.


The summary is actually gonna drive the queries then.

I mean , your research is going to be very circular.


I mean , your research is going to be very circular.


I mean , your research is going to be very circular.

But th there is this , um     There is this class of queries , which are the things that you didn't realize were important at the time but some in retrospect you think " oh , hang on , didn't we talk about that ? " And it 's something that didn't appear in the summary but you


But th there is this , um     There is this class of queries , which are the things that you didn't realize were important at the time but some in retrospect you think " oh , hang on , didn't we talk about that ? " And it 's something that didn't appear in the summary but you


But th there is this , um     There is this class of queries , which are the things that you didn't realize were important at the time but some in retrospect you think " oh , hang on , didn't we talk about that ? " And it 's something that didn't appear in the summary but you

And that 's kind of what this kind of , uh , complete data capture is kind of nicest for.


And that 's kind of what this kind of , uh , complete data capture is kind of nicest for.


And that 's kind of what this kind of , uh , complete data capture is kind of nicest for.

Cuz it 's the things that you wouldn't have bothered to make an effort to record but they get recorded. So , I mean  And th there 's no way of generating those , u u until we just  until they actually occur.


Cuz it 's the things that you wouldn't have bothered to make an effort to record but they get recorded. So , I mean  And th there 's no way of generating those , u u until we just  until they actually occur.

But you could always post - hoc label them.


Cuz it 's the things that you wouldn't have bothered to make an effort to record but they get recorded. So , I mean  And th there 's no way of generating those , u u until we just  until they actually occur.

But you could always post - hoc label them.

You know , it 's like  Right , right. Exactly.


But you could always post - hoc label them.

You know , it 's like  Right , right. Exactly.

But I mean , it 's difficult to sort of say " and if I was gonna ask four questions about this , what would they be ? " Those aren't the kind of things that come up.


You know , it 's like  Right , right. Exactly.

But I mean , it 's difficult to sort of say " and if I was gonna ask four questions about this , what would they be ? " Those aren't the kind of things that come up.


But I mean , it 's difficult to sort of say " and if I was gonna ask four questions about this , what would they be ? " Those aren't the kind of things that come up.


But I mean , it 's difficult to sort of say " and if I was gonna ask four questions about this , what would they be ? " Those aren't the kind of things that come up.

I also think that w if  if you can use the summaries as an indication of the important points of the  of the meeting , then you might get something like  y So if th if the obscure item you want to know more about was some form of data collection , you know , maybe the summary would say , you know , " we discussed types of na data collection ". And , you know  And  and maybe you could get to it by that. If you  if you had the  the larger structure of the  of the discourse , then if you can categorize what it is that you 're looking for with reference to those l those larger headings , then you can find it even if you don't have a direct route to that.


I also think that w if  if you can use the summaries as an indication of the important points of the  of the meeting , then you might get something like  y So if th if the obscure item you want to know more about was some form of data collection , you know , maybe the summary would say , you know , " we discussed types of na data collection ". And , you know  And  and maybe you could get to it by that. If you  if you had the  the larger structure of the  of the discourse , then if you can categorize what it is that you 're looking for with reference to those l those larger headings , then you can find it even if you don't have a direct route to that.

Mmm. Although it seems like that 's , um , a high burden on the note - taker.


I also think that w if  if you can use the summaries as an indication of the important points of the  of the meeting , then you might get something like  y So if th if the obscure item you want to know more about was some form of data collection , you know , maybe the summary would say , you know , " we discussed types of na data collection ". And , you know  And  and maybe you could get to it by that. If you  if you had the  the larger structure of the  of the discourse , then if you can categorize what it is that you 're looking for with reference to those l those larger headings , then you can find it even if you don't have a direct route to that.

Mmm. Although it seems like that 's , um , a high burden on the note - taker.

That 's a pretty fine grain that the note - taker will have to take.


Mmm. Although it seems like that 's , um , a high burden on the note - taker.

That 's a pretty fine grain that the note - taker will have to take.

Maybe Landay can put a student in to be a note - taker.


That 's a pretty fine grain that the note - taker will have to take.

Maybe Landay can put a student in to be a note - taker.

I th No. I think you got to have somebody who knows the pro knows the topic or  you know , whose job it is delegated to be the note - taker.


Maybe Landay can put a student in to be a note - taker.

I th No. I think you got to have somebody who knows the pro knows the topic or  you know , whose job it is delegated to be the note - taker.


I th No. I think you got to have somebody who knows the pro knows the topic or  you know , whose job it is delegated to be the note - taker.


No , I mean , but someone who can come sit in on the meetings and then takes the notes with them that the real note - taker


No , I mean , but someone who can come sit in on the meetings and then takes the notes with them that the real note - taker

And that way that one student has , you know , a rough idea of what was going on , and they can use it for their research. I mean , this isn't really necessarily what you would do in a real system ,


And that way that one student has , you know , a rough idea of what was going on , and they can use it for their research. I mean , this isn't really necessarily what you would do in a real system ,


and maybe it 's not the best way to do it. But if he has some students that want to study that then they should sort of get to know the people and attend those meetings ,


and maybe it 's not the best way to do it. But if he has some students that want to study that then they should sort of get to know the people and attend those meetings ,

and get the notes from the note - taker or something.


and get the notes from the note - taker or something.


and get the notes from the note - taker or something.

Well , I think that 's a little bit of a problem. Their sort of note - taking application stuff they 've been doing for the last couple of years , and I don't think anyone is still working on it.


Well , I think that 's a little bit of a problem. Their sort of note - taking application stuff they 've been doing for the last couple of years , and I don't think anyone is still working on it.


Well , I think that 's a little bit of a problem. Their sort of note - taking application stuff they 've been doing for the last couple of years , and I don't think anyone is still working on it.

I think they 're done. Um , so I 'm not sure that they have anyone currently working on notes. So what we 'd have to interest someone in is the combination of note and speech.


I think they 're done. Um , so I 'm not sure that they have anyone currently working on notes. So what we 'd have to interest someone in is the combination of note and speech.

And so the question is " is there such a person ? " And I think right now , the answer is " no ".


And so the question is " is there such a person ? " And I think right now , the answer is " no ".


I 've been thinking about it a little bit here  about the  uh , th this , e um  I think that the  now I 'm thinking that the summary  a summary , uh , is actually a reasonable , uh , bootstrap into this  into what we 'd like to get at. It 's  it 's not ideal , but we  you know , we  we have to get started someplace. So I was  I was just thinking about , um , suppose we wanted to get  w We have this collection of meeting. We have five hours of stuff. Uh , we get that transcribed. So now we have five hours of meetings and , uh , you ask me , uh , uh , " Morgan , what d you know , what kind of questions do you want to ask ? " Uh , I wouldn't have any idea what kind of questions I want to ask. I 'd have to get started someplace. So in fact if I looked at summary of it , I 'd go " oh , yeah , I was in that meeting , I remember that , um , what was the part that  " And  and th I think that might then help me to think of things  even things that aren't listed in the summary , but just as a  as a  as a refresh of what the general thing was going on in the meeting.


I 've been thinking about it a little bit here  about the  uh , th this , e um  I think that the  now I 'm thinking that the summary  a summary , uh , is actually a reasonable , uh , bootstrap into this  into what we 'd like to get at. It 's  it 's not ideal , but we  you know , we  we have to get started someplace. So I was  I was just thinking about , um , suppose we wanted to get  w We have this collection of meeting. We have five hours of stuff. Uh , we get that transcribed. So now we have five hours of meetings and , uh , you ask me , uh , uh , " Morgan , what d you know , what kind of questions do you want to ask ? " Uh , I wouldn't have any idea what kind of questions I want to ask. I 'd have to get started someplace. So in fact if I looked at summary of it , I 'd go " oh , yeah , I was in that meeting , I remember that , um , what was the part that  " And  and th I think that might then help me to think of things  even things that aren't listed in the summary , but just as a  as a  as a refresh of what the general thing was going on in the meeting.

I think it serves two purpo purposes. One , as sort of a refresh to help bootstrap queries ,


I think it serves two purpo purposes. One , as sort of a refresh to help bootstrap queries ,

but also , I mean , maybe we do want to generate summaries. And then it 's  you know , it 's kind of a key.


but also , I mean , maybe we do want to generate summaries. And then it 's  you know , it 's kind of a key.


but also , I mean , maybe we do want to generate summaries. And then it 's  you know , it 's kind of a key.

Yeah , absolutely. Then you want to have it.


Yeah , absolutely. Then you want to have it.


I 'm not against the idea of a summary ,


I 'm not against the idea of a summary ,

but I wanted to think carefully about who 's generating it


but I wanted to think carefully about who 's generating it

and how  because the summary will drive the queries.


but I wanted to think carefully about who 's generating it

and how  because the summary will drive the queries.

What I  I think , you know , in most meetings ,


and how  because the summary will drive the queries.

What I  I think , you know , in most meetings ,


and how  because the summary will drive the queries.

What I  I think , you know , in most meetings ,

this one being  different , but in most meetings that I attend , there 's somebody t explicitly taking notes , frequently on a laptop  Um , you can just make it be on a laptop ,


What I  I think , you know , in most meetings ,

this one being  different , but in most meetings that I attend , there 's somebody t explicitly taking notes , frequently on a laptop  Um , you can just make it be on a laptop ,


this one being  different , but in most meetings that I attend , there 's somebody t explicitly taking notes , frequently on a laptop  Um , you can just make it be on a laptop ,

so then yo you 're dealing with ASCII and not somebody  you don't have to go through handwriting recognition. Um , and then they post - edit it into , uh , a summary and they email it out for minutes. I mean , that happens in most meetings.


this one being  different , but in most meetings that I attend , there 's somebody t explicitly taking notes , frequently on a laptop  Um , you can just make it be on a laptop ,

so then yo you 're dealing with ASCII and not somebody  you don't have to go through handwriting recognition. Um , and then they post - edit it into , uh , a summary and they email it out for minutes. I mean , that happens in most meetings.

I I  I think that , um , there 's  we 're using " summary " in two different ways. So what you just described I would describe as " minutes ".


so then yo you 're dealing with ASCII and not somebody  you don't have to go through handwriting recognition. Um , and then they post - edit it into , uh , a summary and they email it out for minutes. I mean , that happens in most meetings.

I I  I think that , um , there 's  we 're using " summary " in two different ways. So what you just described I would describe as " minutes ".


I I  I think that , um , there 's  we 're using " summary " in two different ways. So what you just described I would describe as " minutes ".


And what I originally thought was , um , if you asked someone " what was the meeting about ? "


And what I originally thought was , um , if you asked someone " what was the meeting about ? "

And then they would say " well , we talked about this and then we talked about that , and so - and - so talked about  " And then you 'd have , like  I  e My thought was to have multiple people summarize it , on recording rather than writing because writing takes time and you get irrelevant other things that u take time , that


And then they would say " well , we talked about this and then we talked about that , and so - and - so talked about  " And then you 'd have , like  I  e My thought was to have multiple people summarize it , on recording rather than writing because writing takes time and you get irrelevant other things that u take time , that


And then they would say " well , we talked about this and then we talked about that , and so - and - so talked about  " And then you 'd have , like  I  e My thought was to have multiple people summarize it , on recording rather than writing because writing takes time and you get irrelevant other things that u take time , that

Whereas if you just say it immediately after the meeting , you know , a two - minute summary of what the meeting was about , I think you would get , uh , with mult See , I  I also worry about having a single note - taker because that 's just one person 's perception. And , um , you know , it  it 's releva it 's relative to what you 're focus was on that meeting ,


Whereas if you just say it immediately after the meeting , you know , a two - minute summary of what the meeting was about , I think you would get , uh , with mult See , I  I also worry about having a single note - taker because that 's just one person 's perception. And , um , you know , it  it 's releva it 's relative to what you 're focus was on that meeting ,

and  and people have different  major topics that they 're interested in.


Whereas if you just say it immediately after the meeting , you know , a two - minute summary of what the meeting was about , I think you would get , uh , with mult See , I  I also worry about having a single note - taker because that 's just one person 's perception. And , um , you know , it  it 's releva it 's relative to what you 're focus was on that meeting ,

and  and people have different  major topics that they 're interested in.

So , my proposal would be that it may be worth considering both of those types , you know , the note - taking and a spontaneous oral summary afterwards ,


and  and people have different  major topics that they 're interested in.

So , my proposal would be that it may be worth considering both of those types , you know , the note - taking and a spontaneous oral summary afterwards ,


So , my proposal would be that it may be worth considering both of those types , you know , the note - taking and a spontaneous oral summary afterwards ,


but  but , uh , my impression was that , uh , pretty much , uh , true that the meetings here , nobody sits with a w uh , with a laptop


but  but , uh , my impression was that , uh , pretty much , uh , true that the meetings here , nobody sits with a w uh , with a laptop

Never. I 've never seen it at ICSI. Does anyone  ?


Never. I 've never seen it at ICSI. Does anyone  ?


Never. I 've never seen it at ICSI. Does anyone  ?

I mean , Dan is the one who  who most frequently would take notes ,


I mean , Dan is the one who  who most frequently would take notes ,


I mean , Dan is the one who  who most frequently would take notes ,

I 've d When we  when we have other meetings. When I have meetings on the European projects , we have someone taking notes.


I 've d When we  when we have other meetings. When I have meetings on the European projects , we have someone taking notes.


I 've d When we  when we have other meetings. When I have meetings on the European projects , we have someone taking notes.

Yeah , but those are bigger deal things.


Yeah , but those are bigger deal things.


I mean , most  th this is one of the larger meetings. Most of the meetings we have are four or five people


I mean , most  th this is one of the larger meetings. Most of the meetings we have are four or five people

and you 're not  you don't have somebody sitting and taking minutes for it.


and you 're not  you don't have somebody sitting and taking minutes for it.


and you 're not  you don't have somebody sitting and taking minutes for it.

You just  get together and talk about where you are.


and you 're not  you don't have somebody sitting and taking minutes for it.

You just  get together and talk about where you are.

So , I think it depends on whether it 's a business meeting or a technical discussion.


You just  get together and talk about where you are.

So , I think it depends on whether it 's a business meeting or a technical discussion.


So , I think it depends on whether it 's a business meeting or a technical discussion.


technical discussions you don't usually have somebody taking notes.


technical discussions you don't usually have somebody taking notes.

The IRAM meeting , they  they take notes every


The IRAM meeting , they  they take notes every

There 's uh a person with a laptop  at each meeting.


There 's uh a person with a laptop  at each meeting.

There are more. I mean , there are ten - ish.


There are more. I mean , there are ten - ish.

Y you should also have a record of what 's on the board.


Y you should also have a record of what 's on the board.


Y you should also have a record of what 's on the board.

I mean , I find it very  hard to reconstruct what 's going on. I  I don't know how


I mean , I find it very  hard to reconstruct what 's going on. I  I don't know how

Yeah. This is something early in the project we talked a lot about.


I mean , I find it very  hard to reconstruct what 's going on. I  I don't know how

Yeah. This is something early in the project we talked a lot about.

I don't know how , but for instance , I mean , the outline is sort of up here and that 's what people are seeing. And if you have a  Or you shou could tell people not to  to use the boards. But there 's sort of this missing information otherwise.


Yeah. This is something early in the project we talked a lot about.

I don't know how , but for instance , I mean , the outline is sort of up here and that 's what people are seeing. And if you have a  Or you shou could tell people not to  to use the boards. But there 's sort of this missing information otherwise.

I agree , but  but you  you just  you g end up with video ,


I don't know how , but for instance , I mean , the outline is sort of up here and that 's what people are seeing. And if you have a  Or you shou could tell people not to  to use the boards. But there 's sort of this missing information otherwise.

I agree , but  but you  you just  you g end up with video ,


I agree , but  but you  you just  you g end up with video ,


I agree , but  but you  you just  you g end up with video ,

and  and instrumented rooms. And  that 's a different project , I think.


and  and instrumented rooms. And  that 's a different project , I think.

f u I think for this data capture , it would be nice to have a digital camera


f u I think for this data capture , it would be nice to have a digital camera

just to take pictures of who 's there , where the microphones are , and then we could also put in what 's on the board. You know , like three or four snaps for every


just to take pictures of who 's there , where the microphones are , and then we could also put in what 's on the board. You know , like three or four snaps for every


just to take pictures of who 's there , where the microphones are , and then we could also put in what 's on the board. You know , like three or four snaps for every

Yeah. People who were never at the meeting will have a very hard time understanding it otherwise.


Yeah. People who were never at the meeting will have a very hard time understanding it otherwise.


But don't you think that 's  Don't you think that  But


Well , no. I mean , I  I just think  I mean , I think that right now we don't make a record of where people are sitting on the tables.


Well , no. I mean , I  I just think  I mean , I think that right now we don't make a record of where people are sitting on the tables.

And that  the  at some point that might be awfully useful.


And that  the  at some point that might be awfully useful.

Right. But I think adding photographs adds a whole nother level of problems.


Right. But I think adding photographs adds a whole nother level of problems.


Not  not as part of the  not as a part of the data that you have to recover.


Not  not as part of the  not as a part of the data that you have to recover.

We should just  Like archiving it or storing it.


We should just  Like archiving it or storing it.


It 's i because discourse is about things ,


It 's i because discourse is about things ,

and then you have the things that are about , and it 's recoverable.


It 's i because discourse is about things ,

and then you have the things that are about , and it 's recoverable.

someone later might be able to take these and say " OK , they , you know  at least these are the people who were there


and then you have the things that are about , and it 's recoverable.

someone later might be able to take these and say " OK , they , you know  at least these are the people who were there


and then you have the things that are about , and it 's recoverable.

someone later might be able to take these and say " OK , they , you know  at least these are the people who were there

and here 's sort of what they started talking about , and  " and just


someone later might be able to take these and say " OK , they , you know  at least these are the people who were there

and here 's sort of what they started talking about , and  " and just


and here 's sort of what they started talking about , and  " and just


u uh , Liz , you sa you sat in on the , uh ,  subcommittee meeting or whatever


u uh , Liz , you sa you sat in on the , uh ,  subcommittee meeting or whatever

uh , on  you  on the subcommittee meeting for  for  at the , uh  that workshop we were at that , uh , uh , Mark Liberman was  was having. So I  I wasn't there. They  they  they  they h must have had some discussion about video and the visual aspect , and all that.


uh , on  you  on the subcommittee meeting for  for  at the , uh  that workshop we were at that , uh , uh , Mark Liberman was  was having. So I  I wasn't there. They  they  they  they h must have had some discussion about video and the visual aspect , and all that.


uh , on  you  on the subcommittee meeting for  for  at the , uh  that workshop we were at that , uh , uh , Mark Liberman was  was having. So I  I wasn't there. They  they  they  they h must have had some discussion about video and the visual aspect , and all that.

I mean , it  personally , I don't  I would never want to deal with it. But I 'm just saying first of all there 's a whole bunch of fusion issues that DARPA 's interested in.


I mean , it  personally , I don't  I would never want to deal with it. But I 'm just saying first of all there 's a whole bunch of fusion issues that DARPA 's interested in.


I mean , it  personally , I don't  I would never want to deal with it. But I 'm just saying first of all there 's a whole bunch of fusion issues that DARPA 's interested in.

You know , fusing gesture and face recognition ,


You know , fusing gesture and face recognition ,

even lip movement and things like that , for this kind of task. And there 's also I think a personal interest on the part of Mark Liberman in this kind of  in storing these images in any data we collect


even lip movement and things like that , for this kind of task. And there 's also I think a personal interest on the part of Mark Liberman in this kind of  in storing these images in any data we collect

so that later we can do other things with it.


even lip movement and things like that , for this kind of task. And there 's also I think a personal interest on the part of Mark Liberman in this kind of  in storing these images in any data we collect

so that later we can do other things with it.

Yeah. So  so to address what  what Adam 's saying ,


so that later we can do other things with it.

Yeah. So  so to address what  what Adam 's saying ,


Yeah. So  so to address what  what Adam 's saying ,

I mean , I think you  uh , that the key thing there is that this is a description of database collection effort that they 're talking about doing.


I mean , I think you  uh , that the key thing there is that this is a description of database collection effort that they 're talking about doing.


I mean , I think you  uh , that the key thing there is that this is a description of database collection effort that they 're talking about doing.

And if the database exists and includes some visual information that doesn't mean that an individual researcher is going to make any use of it. Right ?


And if the database exists and includes some visual information that doesn't mean that an individual researcher is going to make any use of it. Right ?


And if the database exists and includes some visual information that doesn't mean that an individual researcher is going to make any use of it. Right ?

But that  it 's gonna be a lot of effort on our part to create it , and store it , and get all the standards , and to do anything with it.


But that  it 's gonna be a lot of effort on our part to create it , and store it , and get all the standards , and to do anything with it.

Right. So we 're gonna  So we 're gonna do what we 're gonna do , whatever 's reasonable for us.


Right. So we 're gonna  So we 're gonna do what we 're gonna do , whatever 's reasonable for us.


Like I know with ATIS , we just had a tape recorder running all the time.


Like I know with ATIS , we just had a tape recorder running all the time.

And later on it turned out it was really good that you had a tape recorder of what was happening , even though you w you just got the speech from the machine. So if you can find some really , you know , low , uh , perplexity ,


And later on it turned out it was really good that you had a tape recorder of what was happening , even though you w you just got the speech from the machine. So if you can find some really , you know , low , uh , perplexity ,

yeah ,  way of  of doing that , I think it would be worthwhile.


yeah ,  way of  of doing that , I think it would be worthwhile.

I agree. And if it 's simple as  I mean , as simple as just the digital


I agree. And if it 's simple as  I mean , as simple as just the digital

Well , minimally , I mean , what  what Dan is referring to at least having some representation of the p the spatial position of the people ,


Well , minimally , I mean , what  what Dan is referring to at least having some representation of the p the spatial position of the people ,

cuz we are interested in some spatial processing.


cuz we are interested in some spatial processing.


Well , once the room is a little more fixed that 's a little easier